LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.0

Help for ARSCLIST Archives


ARSCLIST Archives

ARSCLIST Archives


[email protected]


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST  November 2012

ARSCLIST November 2012

Subject:

Re: Interesting history of DGG-Polydor-Polygram-Berliner Studios-SACD-etc

From:

Jon Samuels <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sun, 25 Nov 2012 08:28:29 -0800

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (53 lines)

One issue that no one has raised about DSD is the problems working with it after recording.  DSD is very difficult to edit, and even harder to manipulate sonically (EQ, for example).  Part of the reason is it's one-bit design; another is that because only a few studios use it, equipment vendors have been loathe to create gear that will have so few sales.  

As an example of a high-end compromise, the DAW Pyramix convert a DSD file to PCM 32 bit/388khz so that an engineer can work on it, and then convert it back to DSD when the work is completed.

Jon Samuels

--- On Fri, 11/23/12, Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

From: Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Interesting history of DGG-Polydor-Polygram-Berliner Studios-SACD-etc
To: [log in to unmask]
Date: Friday, November 23, 2012, 7:13 PM

I'm hoping Mark Donahue will chime in here. If they were comparing 96/24 PCM to DSD, when the audio was digitized to 96/24 PCM in the first place, of course they'd hear no differences. I remember this issue coming up with the Mercury Living Presence SACDs, which were done in Germany with no direct involvement from any original Mercury team members. The only time DSD came into the picture was after all the transferring, whatever DSP was deployed, normalizing, etc. The final PCM files were converted to DSD for SACD disc authoring. A beef in the audiophile press at the time was that "no advantages of SACD were realized," that they just as soon have put out 96/24 DVD-audio discs (which actually would have been a better idea since most DVD players until the recent generations of ultra-cheapos could play DVD-A discs whereas fewer players could play SACD). Anyway, supposedly the advantages of DSD are only heard when the product is DSD from input to output,
 which is what Mark Donahue did with the RCA Living Stereo SACDs.

As far as I know, during most or all of the time that Universal was playing in the SACD world, they were doing their transferring and production in PCM, then going to DSD for the final SACD authoring. It may all have been based on that listening test mentioned in this thread, but I'd argue that the test parameters seem flawed.

-- Tom Fine

----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard L. Hess" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, November 23, 2012 6:10 PM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Interesting history of DGG-Polydor-Polygram-Berliner Studios-SACD-etc


> There may have been some misinterpretation of this statement.
> 
> Some people are referring to this as DSD vs CD. However, based on Goran's later posting today concerning this, it appears that the PCM in question is 24 bit 96 ks/s.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Richard
> 
> 
> On 2012-11-23 2:23 PM, Goran Finnberg wrote:
>>   During the recording of Mahler´s 2nd Symphony (Vienna Philharmonic
>> Orchestra, Gilbert Kaplan, released on Deutsche Grammophon CD 474 380-2,
>> SACD 477 594-2) in the Musikvereinssaal, Vienna, the whole recording
>> sequence is carried out by using both PCM and DSD technology following the
>> microphone.
>> 
>> To exclude sound variations by different A/D converters, the team uses
>> special converters capable of dealing with both formats. The result of the
>> subsequent listening comparisons by double-blind test is as straight-forward
>> as sobering: There is no difference whatsoever.
> 
> -- Richard L. Hess                   email: [log in to unmask]
> Aurora, Ontario, Canada           (905) 713 6733     1-877-TAPE-FIX
> http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm
> Quality tape transfers -- even from hard-to-play tapes.
> 

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

March 2024
February 2024
January 2024
December 2023
November 2023
October 2023
September 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
March 2023
February 2023
January 2023
December 2022
November 2022
October 2022
September 2022
August 2022
July 2022
June 2022
May 2022
April 2022
March 2022
February 2022
January 2022
December 2021
November 2021
October 2021
September 2021
August 2021
July 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
January 2021
December 2020
November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.LOC.GOV

CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager