LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.0

Help for ARSCLIST Archives


ARSCLIST Archives

ARSCLIST Archives


[email protected]


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST  August 2006

ARSCLIST August 2006

Subject:

Re: Podcasting--explained a bit...

From:

Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:03:25 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (128 lines)

Seems like you have a good handle on what's in your shelves. I'd argue that you are more a collector 
than an accumulator. The accumulator would simply have an endless stream of boxes of records, no 
rhyme nor reason, piling up with no hope of ever being sorted or tallied.

Junk is the crap you find in the $1 bin at most used vinyl stores -- mostly bad music by most 
standards (70s disco, for instance) in terrible condition. In the 78 world, junk is the 
played-to-death piles found in grandma's lamp table. Again, if it's not totally obscure, it's 
probably been reissued on CD, from the metal parts with some engineering skill involved in the 
transfer. Yes, some more obscure old stuff is a matter for a collector -- but a true collector would 
never bother with the played-to-death moldy old disks better usd for target practice.

Price has nothing to do with junk, by the way. For instance, I've seen stuff get bid up on eBay 
that's not properly graded or clearly is damaged (one LP that bid up to over $50 had a clearly 
visible gouge on one side!). On the other hand, I walked into a used vinyl place in upstate NY over 
the weekend and found a small pile of Mercury MG50000 series mono -- some original early 50's, some 
the late 50's reissues, all in excellent sleeves and vinyl in VG or better shape -- for 50 cents 
each. Needless to say, I quickly flashed the small bills and walked out with the pile. I mainly 
bought these for the sleeves, which are in better shape than the family collection.

I should probably say something else here. Those of us who speak with strong words about a high 
quality ethic don't say this just to be arrogant or to elevate ourselves to some alleged plain of 
"golden ears." It comes down to what Steve Smolian and Bob Ohlsson have been saying about being 
respectful and true to the original artist and product. THAT was where the real talent lay -- in 
both the musicians who made the unforgettable takes and in the engineers and producers who captured 
them for history. We do those people a disservice and show disrespect when we settle for less than 
the excellence they practiced.

-- Tom Fine

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Roger and Allison Kulp" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Podcasting--explained a bit...


> Clarify what you mean by "junk".Those of us,who are true collectors,have the common, the rare,and 
> the unknown.The common stuff,in my case,being things like more common pre-stereo RCA,and Columbia 
> classical,and more conmmon Mercurys, etc.,as I am trying for nonoperatic completeness.(I also own 
> unissued lacquers.)And as for rock/R&B,I own more common commercially successful records,from the 
> 60s,and 70s,as well,as unknown records,that were never comped/reissued,or have only been in the 
> past couple of years.And yes,everything IS great condition,and at least of cultural/historic 
> importance.
>  Roger Kulp
>
> Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>  There's definitely a difference between an archivist and a collector. And there's also a big
> difference between a true collector and an accumulator. As any fan of jazz knows, true collectors
> are gold because they'll have a great-condition version of a record -- be it 78RPM or 45 single or
> even LP -- for which the master tape is lost or deteriorated. You see transfers of 45 and 78
> versions end up on Mosaic sets all the time, for instance. On the other hand, the accumulator is 
> not
> as useful because has just, well, accumulated. He probably doesn't even know what he has because 
> he
> doesn't stop to take measure -- he just keeps filling his space with boxes and boxes and boxes of
> records. Most of them are junk, not even worth the sweat equity of hauling in. The junk clutters 
> the
> whole scene, making it nearly impossible to find the gems. There's a psychological problem related
> to blind acquisition of things, I forgot what it's called. Collectors (and archivists) have our 
> own
> psycho problems, so I certainly shouldn't throw stones! An archivist is one step beyond a
> collector. He's usually a funded professional, who has learned the standard methods of preserving
> and cataloging his material. He is focused on preserving and accumulating excellent samples of
> whatever genre his archive is all about. The achivist is a natural friend and sometimes student of
> the collector, whose passion may have led to arcane knowledge way beyond the scope of the
> archivist's formal education. The accumulator is kind of a pilot-fish to the whole process. He 
> might
> well have some very deep and arcane knowledge, and is thus worth knowing, but usually he doesn't
> even really know what he has and is too busy accumulating to take the time to dig deep and see.
> Sometimes, though, he's generous enough to let the archivist or collector sift thru the mountains 
> of
> junk (hopefully wearing masks and gloves to avoid mouse contamination) and there may be gold in 
> them
> thar stacks -- not likely but it does happen. As time goes on and the genre or artist or subject 
> of
> interest becomes more and more out of date and obscure, the accumulator becomes more valuable to 
> the
> archivist because history has a tendency to become more and more completist over time. You get 50
> years out and the only "new" shine you can put on something is to release every rejected take or
> amateur live recording you can find. You get a thoroughly mined artist -- and legend -- like 
> Charlie
> Parker, and all you're left to do is release amateur wire recordings of solos only (not even
> complete tunes). And lo and behold, there will be at least a few buyers for all of it! Meanwhile,
> out in the real world, the vast majority will have long forgotten the whole thing and the 
> archivist
> will have to fight for every penny every year. Guys, we live in a strange universe.
>
> -- Tom Fine
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Lou Judson"
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 11:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Podcasting--explained a bit...
>
>
> Steven, I wonder if there is a idfference between and archivist and a
> record collector? You definitely seem to be the latter. I wonder if
> someone can get a grant to come and actually archive and digitize your
> collection?!?
>
> A true archivist does not want to "modernize" the sound of your 78s -
> merely to preserve and protect them, and make them available to more
> people I truly hope that your collection will outlive us both but how
> likely is it that they will end up in landfill after we go?
>
> Perhaps you are the perfect person to recieve the several older Macs I
> am pondering what to do with as they take up space in my storage that I
> pay for monthly... Maybe we could take up a collection to pay for
> shipping them up there so you can play to your heart's content with
> preserving and spreading your collection!?!
>
> Lou Judson . Intuitive Audio
> 415-883-2689
>
> On Aug 23, 2006, at 7:20 PM, steven c wrote:
>
>> 3) Finally, keep in mind that I have been listening to 78's since they
>> were actually state-of-the-art records...and particularly since about
>> 1973, which was well before the invention of either digital applications
>> to modernize the sound of 78's and such...as well as digital sound
>> itself. =
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Yahoo! Small Business. 

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

March 2024
February 2024
January 2024
December 2023
November 2023
October 2023
September 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
March 2023
February 2023
January 2023
December 2022
November 2022
October 2022
September 2022
August 2022
July 2022
June 2022
May 2022
April 2022
March 2022
February 2022
January 2022
December 2021
November 2021
October 2021
September 2021
August 2021
July 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
January 2021
December 2020
November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.LOC.GOV

CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager