LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.0

Help for ARSCLIST Archives


ARSCLIST Archives

ARSCLIST Archives


ARSCLIST@LISTSERV.LOC.GOV


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST  April 2007

ARSCLIST April 2007

Subject:

Re: commerical reels history (was Boston Pops question)

From:

Roger and Allison Kulp <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Mon, 9 Apr 2007 15:25:35 -0700

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (159 lines)

There are two track stereo Westminster reels.I sold one on eBay a while back.It was Scherchen,of course.I can't recall what it was,it may have been "Messiah". It went for about $140.00.I was pretty surprised.


                                  Roger

Rod Stephens <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Tom Fine wrote:

> Hi Jack:
>
> Just to clarify the history here, when you say "2-track (non-stereo)" 
> do you mean half-track (2-sided mono) or do you mean one-direction 
> mono? And, if you mean one-direction mono, are you sure they are not 
> full-track? It should clarify this on the tape boxes, although the 
> nomenclature used early on varied between companies.

I have three Sonotape recordings on 7" reels which are from the 
Westminster catalog.   They are each labeled on the back of the box,
Recording:   Half Track--(Upper)
Speed:         7 1/2 inches per second
Track 1:       Forward
Track 2:       Reverse

>
> I forgot to mention one thing in my post before -- some of these old 
> tapes can be real gems and the best available source. Here's a 
> for-instance. Apparently, the master tapes for most or all of the 
> Everest Woody Herman albums are lost. The CD reissues are all 
> obviously (and poorly) made from LPs (clearly audible groove 
> distortion, sloppy and overbearing tick and pop removal, digital 
> artifacts galore from over-agressive noise-reduction). I was able to 
> borrow the quarter-track, not even the 2-track but the early 
> quarter-track duped reels and it was like night and day. Especially in 
> the case of the Woody Herman and Tito Puente session, the reels were 
> dynamic and rarely distorted while the CD reissue made from LPs was 
> awful. There was an earlier European or Asian CD of this same material 
> that sounds like it was made from a cleaner LP and is not aggressively 
> digi-tooled to where there are annoying artifacts but it's still not 
> as good as the reel. From what I've been able to gather, most of the 
> Everest pop and jazz master tapes are either lost or badly damaged, so 
> one hopes there are a few more of these quarter-track, or better 
> 2-track, reels floating around. Especially in the case of the earlier 
> dupers (half-tracks, 2-tracks and very early quarter-tracks), the 
> quality is usually very good aside from hissy tape. By the early 60's, 
> duping speeds were faster and quality is not as good. By the time you 
> got to the release product being 3.75IPS and duping speeds were up to 
> 16x, the quality was awful. Aside from saving tape, duping to 3.75IPS 
> allowed standard duping speeds in factories that by then were mainly 
> doing 8-tracks, although a place with a decent on-going quarter-track 
> business would have a separate duping line for that.
>
> There are several good articles covering the evolution of tape duping 
> in the archives of the AES Journal. Anyone interested can search and 
> buy articles at the AES website. Ampex published articles about the 
> first 3200 system in the mid-50's, their higher-speed system for 
> multiple formats in teh early 60's and their solid-state bin-loop 
> system in the late 60's. I believe at least one of the makers of 
> cassette duping equipment published at least one article, too.
>
> Tape duping must have been at least marginally profitable because 
> people stayed in it all through reels, 8-tracks and cassettes. There 
> was one brief moment, at the end of the LP era as CD's were just 
> catching on, maybe 2 years in the early 80's, when cassettes outsold 
> LPs. This was after the Walkman caught on big-time and before CD's 
> were mainstream (when players still cost a grand and didn't sound so 
> great). CD's then caught on and the cassette began submerging. I'm not 
> sure there are any large-scale cassette duping for commercial music 
> operations left. There are some operations taylored to smaller jobs 
> who will do, for instance, 100 copies of a set of medical conference 
> recordings or 1000 cassette box sets for Radio Spirits. I believe 
> cassette duping for music is still a viable business in Asia but I 
> might be wrong about that.
>
> -- Tom Fine
>
> -- Tom Fine
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Palmer" 
> To: 
> Sent: Sunday, April 08, 2007 8:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] commerical reels history (was Boston Pops 
> question)
>
>
>>    I checked about a hundred of my tapes and I am not sure any of the 
>> 2 track (non stereo) were from 1952.  I have several 2 track 
>> non-stereo tapes, 7 1/2 speed that were issued by Ampex for London.  
>> No date on the box or tape reel, so I can't be certain of the date.  
>> None of the early 2 tracks I bought were stereo though.  I thought 
>> the high-fidelity was great and worth the money. Thanks for making me 
>> look.  I found three Gilbert and Sullivan operettas on reels that I 
>> didn't even remember owning.  Jack
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Fine" 
>> 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Sunday, April 08, 2007 7:10 AM
>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] commerical reels history (was Boston Pops 
>> question)
>>
>>
>>> I'd be interested to know what's on them and who released them. I do 
>>> not believe you'll find that they are in fact 2T stereo. They are 
>>> likely half-track (2-sided) mono. If they are stereo, it would be 
>>> very interesting to know who put them out as in 1952 only a few 
>>> people were experimenting with 2-channel stereo recording of music. 
>>> No major labels yet, although I believe RCA started making 2T 
>>> masters in 1954 or even 1953 -- I think Zarathustra with Reiner was 
>>> the first 2T session.
>>>
>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Palmer" 
>>> 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Sunday, April 08, 2007 12:29 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] commerical reels history (was Boston Pops 
>>> question)
>>>
>>>
>>>>    I bought my first 2 track tapes for my reel recorder/player in 
>>>> the Base Exchange in Sidi-Slimane, Morocco in 1952.  I still have a 
>>>> couple of them in fact.   Jack
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Fine" 
>>>> 
>>>> To: 
>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 9:40 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] commerical reels history (was Boston Pops 
>>>> question)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Ampex developed their own, was developed by Leon Wortman in NY and 
>>>>> detailed in a 1951 Radio & TV News article. Wortman's line made 
>>>>> full-track or half-track tapes. Commercial half-track tapes were 
>>>>> available as early as 1951 or 1952, but there was only a very 
>>>>> small consumer market for reel to reel machines at that point. > 
>>>>> Because this was a new format sold at a premium price, a lot of QC 
>>>>> attention was paid by the reputable companies in this era, so the 
>>>>> net quality is very high. Akin to what happened when stereo LPs 
>>>>> came along.
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>


 
---------------------------------
Be a PS3 game guru.
Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games.

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.LOC.GOV

CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager