I left out one "joyful".

dl

Robert J Hodge wrote:
> The boy stood on the boining deck 
> Eatin' peanuts by the peck.
> Why oh why did he not go?
> Because he knew he'd float!
> 
> BH
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of David Lennick
> Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 7:00 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Pancake horror story
> 
> The man with plenty of good peanuts is giving his neighbor none.
> He shan't have any of my peanuts when his peanuts are gone.
> Oh that'll be joyful, joyful,
> Oh that'll be joyful, when his peanuts are gone.
> 
> dl
> 
> Roger and Allison Kulp wrote:
>> Hey,those of us who receive peanuts from other people,have to get rid
> of them somehow...
>>                                       Roger
>>
>> David Lennick <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Omigod, please don't get
> me started on peanuts. I order from eBay regularly and 
>> buy from most of the major auction dealers, and I scream long and loud
> when I 
>> have to open a large package of 78s buried in peanuts, which have
> become 
>> charged and fragmented and have gotten in between the discs (and all
> over 
>> hell's half acre as I try and remove a 20 pound hockey puck of 78s).
> If I had 
>> the power to uninvent anything, it would be a tossup between the jewel
> case and 
>> styrofoam peanuts, but ultimately the peanuts would win. (All the
> dealer has to 
>> do is wrap something..anything..newspaper, bubble wrap, saran wrap, a
> grocery 
>> bag, around the discs ..but noooooooooooooooooooooooooo!)
>>
>> dl
>>
>> Robert J Hodge wrote:
>>> And peanuts compress and fracture when used to pack anything weighty,
>>> becoming a totally useless mess.   
>>>
>>> And Tom's previously mentioned problem with static electricity cling
> is 
>>> 110% true! Even if the desirable materials are bagged before packing.
>>>  
>>> Don't use them !!!
>>>
>>> Bob Hodge
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List
>>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Scott Phillips
>>> Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 11:50 AM
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Pancake horror story
>>>
>>> Another reason to ship by the fastest way possible is that the
>>> recordings (tape, disk, whatever) will not spend 4 days on either an
>>> unheated loading dock being rained or snowed on, and in the summer
> won't
>>> sit in 100+ degree 95% humidity degree sunshine waiting for shipment
> any
>>> more than they have to....
>>>
>>> I'd also second the notion that keeping the weight down makes
> handling
>>> more likely to be gentle. My own experience is not to use peanuts as
>>> packing material, even in the box within a box situation. Using heavy
>>> bubble wrap with no real space for things to shift works best for me.
>>> Otherwise the box in the center with the recordings in it acts like a
>>> pendulum inside the outer box every time it is dropped. Peanuts just
>>> allow too much movement, settle, and have static electricity
> problems.
>>> Years ago I worked for Sony in QA, and in packaging drop tests for
> new
>>> products it became clear that contrary to what would seem to be
> common
>>> sense, making the packed object and the packaging seem like one mass
> by
>>> holding it securely centered in the packaging with very little give
>>> produced much lower gee forces than allowing 'soft' packaging. The
> key
>>> was both fairly rigid packing materials that kept the shape of what
> was
>>> packed, allowed as little shifting as possible, and allowed enough
> space
>>> around the centrally packed item to protect from damage from outside
>>> protrusion. Bubble wrapping in both the inner and outer boxes fits
> the
>>> bill nicely for most things.
>>>
>>> Just my 1.75 cents.... :>)
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List
>>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Tom Fine
>>> Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 8:44 AM
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Pancake horror story
>>>
>>> Hi Malcolm:
>>>
>>> The mastering engineer advised the parties to consider the shipment a
>>> "write-off" because the tapes were so mangled as to be unfixable.  He
>>> said the tapes were packed in this sloppy manner -- pancakes tapes
>>> between pieces of cardboard with the edges of the cardboard clamped
>>> tight and taped together (which causes edge damage from the get-go).
> The
>>> boxes were so violently handled in shipping that the cardboard worked
>>> loose in transit, spilling tapes from the hub in most cases and
> mangling
>>> edges and tape-pack in all cases. Some tapes were packed horizontal,
>>> some verticle, none wrapped in a protective bubblewrap, all in a
>>> large/heavy box that was obviously dropped hard or slammed around en
>>> route overseas and back. The engineer lays blame squarely on the
> major
>>> copyright holder, saying he doubts a box packed that way would make
> it
>>> cross-country intact, much less overseas and back. The engineer
> states
>>> that he can't believe someone would ship master tapes without boxes
> and
>>> as un-flanged pancakes.
>>>
>>> I would theorize that ANY tapes packaged this way in
> too-bulky/too-heavy
>>> a box would suffer the same damage just being loaded and unloaded
> from a
>>> ground-shipping truck. I further theorize the major damage came
> either
>>> in a shipping depot or when cargo shifted during a rough airplane
>>> landing on the way to or from overseas. The point is, if you pack
>>> something too massive, damage is almost inevitable due to simple
>>> physics/gravity, which is why I advise clients to keep boxes small to
>>> medium and weight per box down and wrap everything in bubble wrap. I
>>> forgot to mention last night that I also advise clients to wrap
> grooved
>>> disks and tapes in a plastic bag during most seasons so as to avoid
>>> damage if the box is dunked in a puddle or slush in the gutter or
> left
>>> out in the rain. 
>>> The nesting a box within a box can be very helpful if there is a sea
> of
>>> packing material to absorb blunt force.
>>>
>>> If I didn't know and trust the people who told me this story, and if
>>> they weren't directly involved, I'd never believe this could have
>>> happened with master tapes owned by a major company. These companies
>>> have been so cored out by "restructuring" and mega-glomeration that
> they
>>> no longer have any knowledgable folks minding the store! I agree with
>>> the engineer, the ultimate blame in this is on the person who chose
> to
>>> pack valuable intellectual property in such a sloppy manner. I would
>>> suggest the shipper behaved like a typical shipper -- these guys are
> not
>>> in the "careful" business.
>>>
>>> My takeaway is never ship pancakes, always have reels in boxes, tape
>>> boxes shut and wrap in bubble-wrap (none of this taping and wrapping
>>> tight enough to squish the reel or tape-pack, by the way), pack tapes
>>> either horizontally or vertically but not both, use medium-sized
> boxes
>>> and nest the box within a larger box in a sea of force-absorbing
>>> material. Perhaps also wrap the nested box in plastic so it is
>>> water-tight. Keep your total weight of tapes vastly under-spec'd to
> your
>>> boxes, so simple physics is your ally instead of your enemy. And ship
>>> via the fastest way you can afford so the tapes do not stay long in
>>> transit. And insure to full value which might, just might, catch a
>>> shipper's attention before they heave your box off a 2-story drop.
> Oh,
>>> and of course communicate clearly enough that you know exactly where
> to
>>> send the tapes!
>>>
>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Malcolm Davidson" 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 8:59 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Pancake horror story
>>>
>>>
>>>> Tom,
>>>>
>>>> "Names deleted because this was told to me in confidence. Suffice to
>>> say,
>>>> these tapes are valuable
>>>> and not replaceable."
>>>>
>>>> This is the statement that caught my attention!  Surely anyone
> making
>>> such a
>>>> decision to send originals needs educating, and rather quickly. I
>>> doubt
>>>> there is anyone on this list who would willingly send original
> content
>>>> anywhere by shipping company.  It shows that, in this case, the
>>> company had
>>>> scant regard for the inherent value of the original analog tapes.
> (If
>>> they
>>>> must send them go with a courier)
>>>>
>>>> Unfortunately it's the same mind set that many people often have
> when
>>> it
>>>> comes to file back up.  A hard disk crash wipes out files that were
>>> never
>>>> backed up, now what?  In the above case, at least we hope there were
>>> digital
>>>> copies of the files.
>>>>
>>>> Malcolm Davidson
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Tom Fine" 
>>>> To: 
>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 6:37 PM
>>>> Subject: [ARSCLIST] Pancake horror story
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Some people swear by the practice of storing reels of tape as
>>> un-flanged
>>>> "pancakes" on a hub. There
>>>>> are some well-documented benefits to this practice, from
> cost-saving
>>> to
>>>> possibly avoiding damage if
>>>>> the box is dropped and flange is mangled badly enough to damage the
>>>> tape-pack. Well, let me tell you
>>>>> a tale ...
>>>>>
>>>>> Names deleted because this was told to me in confidence. Suffice to
>>> say,
>>>> these tapes are valuable
>>>>> and not replaceable.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tapes were archived on hubs, mistakenly shipped overseas and
> mangled
>>> on
>>>> the way back in transit.
>>>>> Badly mangled. It will be lucky if there are not unrepairable
>>> problems in
>>>> parts of tape containing
>>>>> music. This would not have happened if the tapes were on reels,
>>> although
>>>> the mangling was bad enough
>>>>> that the reels may have been bent. The owners of the tapes
> correctly
>>> blame
>>>> the shipping company but
>>>>> I would argue that it's a lesson in just how brutal shippers can
> be,
>>>> especially if a communications
>>>>> problem of lower-level employees gets something sent overseas and
>>> back.
>>>>> My take-away was that if one is to ship tapes as boxed-pancakes,
> one
>>> needs
>>>> to take extreme measures
>>>>> to keep the tape-pack rigid and protected. I would even suggest
>>> rigging
>>>> something up using a metal
>>>>> film can. Certainly don't use decades-old cardboard boxes, even if
>>> they
>>>> are grouped in large box and
>>>>> surrounded by rigid packing material.
>>>>>
>>>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>>        
>> ---------------------------------
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>