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ARSCLIST  February 2012

ARSCLIST February 2012

Subject:

Re: AGFA PE46 problems

From:

Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 17 Feb 2012 18:25:33 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (95 lines)

Hi Scott:

Can you describe exactly the problems you've had with Scotch 206 and 208? And do you have actual 
manufacture dates? When you say "recent vintage," it can't be any more recent than about 20 years 
old, right? Didn't 3M get out of the tape business in the early 90's? To be honest, I didn't know 
they were still making 206 and 208 in the end, I thought they had discontinued those in the 80's, 
and they were down to just 226/227 and 250 in the last years.

I have some virgin 206 from a very late batch here (got it from MRL a few years ago, they had long 
before switched to SM911).

-- Tom Fine

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Scott D. Smith" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 1:41 PM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] AGFA PE46 problems


> Interesting exchange. Based on the comments in this thread, it would appear that my suspicions 
> over the years regarding the variance in quality control at various manufacturing facilities 
> around the world is justified.
>
> FWIT: Although I have experienced shedding issues with various tapes manufactured by both AGFA and 
> BASF, I don't believe I have ever encountered any issues with binder breakdown. I have also had 
> extensive experience with AGFA and BASF magnetic film stocks, both in production use and archival 
> transfers. During the 1970's these were some of the most consistent stocks we encountered. We 
> recently transferred a number of reels of AGFA acetate base stock from the early 1970's, which had 
> excellent wind characteristics, virtually no shedding, and only very minimal VS.
>
> On the other hand, I recently transferred some 1/4" and 1" reels of 3M 206 and 208, some of which 
> was of fairly recent vintage, and all of the material exhibited problems with binder breakdown 
> (all of it was stored in good vault conditions). Go figure....
>
> --Scott
>
> Scott D. Smith CAS
> Chicago Audio Works, Inc.
>
> On 2/17/2012 11:38 AM, Goran Finnberg wrote:
>> Shai Drori:
>>
>>> after years of using BASF tapes I never ran across a bad batch.
>> Agreed 100%
>>
>>> There were obviously better and worse tapes but after working
>>> with them 10-30 years ago and now digitizing them, not a single
>>> tape that needed baking or treatment.
>> Agreed 100%
>>
>> Swedish Radio is at the moment transferring about 300 000 tapes, mostly
>> BASF, to digital and so far after 2 years of doing transfers there has not
>> been one single case of any BASF tapes needing baking.
>>
>> The work is supposed to end in summer 2013 with 25 people working two shifts
>> each day for total 16 hours work each day.
>>
>> All tape machines are Studer. A807, A812 and A820.
>>
>>> Weird.
>> Not so.
>>
>> Dipl.-Ing = Msc EE Günther Dreher of the BASF Applications Engineering Dept.
>> Audio-Tape pointed out to me that BASF is the biggest Chemical Company in
>> the word with more than 150 000 people employed wordwide in the mid 80´s.
>>
>> The magnetic tape department was like an almost nonexistent drop in the
>> ocean that is BASF.
>>
>> That the magnetic tape division went belly up meant nothing to the colossus
>> that is BASF.
>>
>> Günther Dreher told me that BASF was the only company in the world that made
>> ALL the chemical parts contained in the slurry that was coated onto the
>> polyester backing.
>>
>> No other company in the world had this advantage and had to relay on buying
>> what they needed from external sources.
>>
>> This meant that BASF had total control on every single part in the slurry.
>> Which was NOT the case for the competition as the external sources would not
>> reveal in exact detail what was being sold.
>>
>> And the condition that led up to the sticky shed debacle was well known and
>> understood by the chemical engineers at the magnetic tape division according
>> to Günther Dreher.
>>
>> His claim was that "You will never see any BASF magnetic tape go sticky shed
>> ever"
>>
>> So far his claims appear totally true to me.
>>
> 

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