LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.0

Help for ARSCLIST Archives


ARSCLIST Archives

ARSCLIST Archives


[email protected]


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Monospaced Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST Home

ARSCLIST  April 2012

ARSCLIST April 2012

Subject:

Movie sound ( was Re: [ARSCLIST] "Life" IN recordings (or lack thereof),

From:

Randy Riddle <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 26 Apr 2012 06:56:46 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (92 lines)

With musicals, they used a combination of live, on-stage dialogue
sequences with pre-recorded playback for the musical numbers, a
practice that started in the early days of sound after someone figured
out that recording a full orchestra hidden off-screen and a performer
singing live wasn't so easy to pull off, especially if a complicated
number needed to be restaged.

It's odd to watch outtakes from musicals from the classic Hollywood
era - you hear the characters going through dialogue sequence live
with different variations, then start a musical number to a
pre-recorded track, going through exactly the same steps, movements
and facial expressions, over and over again. It's no wonder some of
these people needed drugs to do this work day after day.

I recall reading that Rex Harrison insisted on doing his vocals for
"My Fair Lady" live on-set and that they used some kind of new at the
time wireless mic to accommodate him. If you listen carefully, the
sound quality of his numbers sounds a bit different on the soundtrack
than others in the film.

Shooting silent and dubbing later was much more common in Europe,
particularly in Italy, and took some getting used to by Americans
working overseas on international productions after the War. The
practice produced the strange, alternate universe of Mario Bava's
"Hercules in the Haunted World", where the wonderful tones of
Christopher Lee's English dialogue was dubbed by an actor with a
completely different voice.

And that brings me to something I've always wondered about and may
have mentioned on this list before.

Was there a different eq used for recording film soundtracks in some
countries like Italy?

Even today, I've seen remastered Italian films on dvd and blu-ray from
the 50s, 60s and even into the early 70s that have that same, annoying
tinny sound on both the English dubbed and original Italian dialogue
versions. Are these things being remastered without the proper
re-equalization being applied?

One example I can think of that was redone was Criterion's release of
"Yojimbo". The original laser and dvd release had that same tinny
sound and I think it was mastered from an optical track. The reissue,
remastered from the original mag masters, is properly balanced and has
full, rich sound.

When I had the Criterion original release, I kept a notecard inside
the case with settings for my parametric eq that, to my ears, seemed
to properly compensate for the improper eq.

I've also heard the same issue with some early 30s films and wondered
if some were produced using eq that was different from what was agreed
on later. When I had cable and was a regular viewer of TCM, they
would play some films produced by RKO in RCA's Photophone system that
sounded like they had improper eq - noisy, "throaty", bass heavy sound
that seemed to sound more natural if I tweaked it with my parametric
eq.

On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 6:17 AM, Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Hi Don:
>
> I know for a fact that what you are saying is NOT true. Some movies have
> most or all dialog re-recorded separately from picture shoot, but others
> have most or all dialog recorded as the scenes are being shot. My late
> friend and mentor Bob Eberenz began his career as a dialog recordist in
> Hollywood. In those days (post-WWII 40's), many pictures were recorded
> live-action using a boom mic on a "fishpole." These mics were directional
> and the skill of the dialog recordist was being able to flip the mic in sync
> with a conversation. Boom mics were typically ribbon types, RCA and Western
> Electric each made models for this use. Later on, it became possible to
> "plant" mics around a set to pick up dialog. If you read articles about
> movie-sound today, sometimes recordists plant many mics and record many
> tracks to capture a scene live. In the olden days, according to Bob
> Eberenz's recollections, when dialog was filmed live, the set was declared
> "quiet," and everyone had to shut up and sit still when film was rolling.
> The film camera was in a silencer box, and boom equipment was kept well
> oiled and was designed for quiet movement (but, as I said, the mics were
> highly directional). The sound recordist typically sat at a "cart," which
> contained the mic preamp and usually built-in dialog EQ and sometimes a
> peak-limiter. The line-level signal was fed to the machine room, which could
> be blocks away at a large lot. Soundstage inputs were patched to dubbers for
> recording in the machine room.
>
> My bet is that most non-soundstage footage was dialog re-recorded in a
> controlled environment, but it was definitely possible to capture audible
> dialog in the field. One thing I've always wondered is if many or most
> "Soundies" (jazz shorts) were recorded live-sound or "lip-sync'd" to a
> soundtrack.
>
> -- Tom Fine
>

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

March 2024
February 2024
January 2024
December 2023
November 2023
October 2023
September 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
March 2023
February 2023
January 2023
December 2022
November 2022
October 2022
September 2022
August 2022
July 2022
June 2022
May 2022
April 2022
March 2022
February 2022
January 2022
December 2021
November 2021
October 2021
September 2021
August 2021
July 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
January 2021
December 2020
November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.LOC.GOV

CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager