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ARSCLIST  June 2012

ARSCLIST June 2012

Subject:

Re: audio from pictures

From:

Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Thu, 21 Jun 2012 09:24:14 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

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text/plain (96 lines)

Hi Steve:

I agree with you in general, but I'm talking about recordings where analog playback has produced
poor results -- for instance the badly worn and super-rare Paramount blues records. No transfer I've
heard using analog playback and whatever digi-trix the producer decided to use has produced very
good-sounding results.

I think the pot of gold at the end of the research rainbow for non-physical playback of grooved
media is the ability to "erase" all the noise that comes from the media itself, and of damage to the
media. Then, in theory (and sometime in the future) you'd just be reproducing the information
originally cut into the groove.

For now, I wouldn't worry about your transfer business (or mine) being under dire threat. But I hope
I live long enough to see the day when putting a needle to an old groove for critical playback or
transfer is considered obsolete.

-- Tom Fine

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Smolian" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 8:39 AM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] audio from pictures


> This is a methodology for the future. Carl Haber and his crew at the Lawrence Berkely National
> Lab developed the system that Patrick uses. So does the Library of Congress. it's a great way to
> overcome many of the limitations on problem recordings of various types.
>
> It's still in development and not available to the general public yet, as far as I know. It is
> also excruciatingly expensive.
>
> Needle in groove playback still sounds better. I assume they are also working on improving their
> digital modeling of the physics of playback.
>
> As Mort Sahl said, "The future lied ahead." One reason it is so important to preserve off-the
> (groove?) wall recording media in a protective, stable environment is to allow time for
> technological developments to catch up.
>
> Steve Smolian
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tom Fine
> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 7:41 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] audio from pictures
>
> Hi Michael:
>
> What you say makes sense about the sound of "paper playing." Did you notice it's a pretty steady
> pattern, sounds to me like once a revolution. So my question is, does any modern software "cancel
> out" a regular/steady but complex background noise like that? If so, would it improve audibility?
>
> I wish Patrick's blog-site had linked to hi-rez WAV so we could all experiment at home!
>
> One of the first commercial uses I can envision for this is apply it to all the super-rare but
> beat-to-hell Paramount blues sides and see if better/clearer results can be obtained than out in
> print so far. It would also seem like Patrick's method works for cracked records and cylinders
> because he's basically "pasting together" the groove in a straight line, so it should be
> time-consuming but possible to line up both sides of a crack and just pencil-over or otherwise
> smooth out the crack itself.
>
> -- Tom Fine
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Michael Shoshani" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2012 10:50 PM
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] audio from pictures
>
>
>> On 06/20/2012 06:13 PM, Tom Fine wrote:
>>>
>>> Question -- is there an algorhythm to remove the modulation noise behind
>>> the voice? It seems to be repeated modulation, just like if a disk were
>>> played and the groove was "listing" to one side, sort of a
>>> woosh-woosh-woosh. Because it's a relatively uniform modulation, I'm
>>> wondering if it can be "zero'd out" to improve voice audibility?
>>
>> This actually sounds as though it could be the grain of the paper on which the magazine was
>> printed. It's an extremely regular, constant sound and one that could easily be imagined as
>> coming from a paper disc being "played" by an acoustic pickup.
>>
>> I used to do this with labels of junky records on my Victrola XVI when I was a teenager, cutting
>> spirals into the labels, which is how I recognized the pattern.
>>
>> I don't know if Dr. Feaster is on or reads ARSCLIST. I know he used to be a fairly heavy
>> participant in 78-L years ago.
>>
>> Michael Shoshani
>> Chicago
>>
>

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