Tom --

>> In some ways, but not an exact analog, the so-called "revivalists" were
like punk rockers in the late 70s -- rejecting the current directions their
chosen genre of music had taken and going back to a "simpler" kind of
rhythm and song structure. I put "simpler" in quotes because, as Dave
correctly points out, well-played Dixieland jazz requires superb chops and
rhythm. <<

Yes exactly.  See my note to David Lewis, just sent.

I'm just tired of frequently hearing the vintage and revival jazz forms
carelessly disrespected, since that's my wheelhouse.  Maybe that's not what
you were saying, but I took it that way.  Thanks for taking the time to
look a little deeper.

Revival and preservation of popular music forms isn't new or unusual:
Bluegrass, Blues, Western Swing, Folk, Klezmer, Cajun, and retro-Swing two
decades ago all were all *revival* (for lack of a better term) movements,
rarely successfully commercially exploited, that came from the ground up.

Dave



On Sat, May 23, 2015 at 7:36 AM, Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

> Hi Dave:
>
> And they are good pages! I still don't get why you took as a personal
> attack my question about why a "revival" was needed when original musicians
> were still around making music. You never did answer that question, but I
> do appreciate your off-list apology and efforts to raise the level of
> discourse on-list. Again, my original post concerned the new Condon/Freeman
> box set, and the accompanying question was not an attack on anyone
> (particularly you) but rather an observation that Condon, Freeman and
> others who actually made records in the real "jazz age" were still
> recording in the late 1940s, so why the need for a "revival"?
>
> Based on the fact-based parts of your posts, and the wealth of fact-based
> information on your website, I think I found part of my answer. What was
> called a "revival" wasn't really that. It was more an extension of the "old
> style" jazz styles into a new generation of musicians. The form had never
> died out, so it wasn't being "revived."
>
> In some ways, but not an exact analog, the so-called "revivalists" were
> like punk rockers in the late 70s -- rejecting the current directions their
> chosen genre of music had taken and going back to a "simpler" kind of
> rhythm and song structure. I put "simpler" in quotes because, as Dave
> correctly points out, well-played Dixieland jazz requires superb chops and
> rhythm.
>
> One other point Dave made is true, and backs up my point about "revival"
> being a wrong term for what happened. The interaction between the young
> guys and the old original musicians, plus Atlantic's and others' recordings
> in New Orleans of real musicians playing in the original ways (and the
> establishment of Preservation Hall), shows again that the old music and
> musicians hadn't died out enough to need a "revival," except maybe on
> swing- and bop-obsessed radio stations on the coasts.
>
> Thinking further on this, I wonder if this idea of a "revival" came partly
> from record collectors, who need a "cause" so they can boast that what they
> have is special and rare. Just before, and at the time, that the first
> young "revival" musicians were getting together, many of the original 78s
> were either being reissued (Avakian at Columbia, among others) or compiled
> into LPs (Keepnews and Grauer for RCA, among others). So there wasn't
> really a "scarcity" of anything but original 1920's pressings of records
> (and also keep in mind that bootleg 78s had proliferated in the 1940s, so
> the old music was readily available and not "extinct" or "dormant" by any
> measure).
>
> -- Tom Fine
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Radlauer" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2015 10:10 AM
> Subject: [ARSCLIST] Not a Frisco site
>
>
>  Incidentally, I would add that while my site may contains much on the Trad
>> revival, that is far from the majority of the content.
>>
>> I do have pages dedicated solely to:
>>
>> Eddie Condon
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/24348.html
>>
>> Teagarden
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/34301.html
>>
>> Muggsy Spanier
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/108201.html
>>
>> Pee Wee Russell
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/206.html
>>
>> NORK
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/41101.html
>>
>> ODJB
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/305.html
>>
>> Buddy Bolden
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/179.html
>>
>> Not to mention great depth and award-winning broadcasts/pages on:
>> James P Johnson
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/24264.html
>>
>> Jelly Roll Morton
>> http://jazzhotbigstep.com/67001.html
>>
>> Basie, Ellington, Casa Loma, Goodman, Artie Shaw, Billie, Bix and Ella.
>> Early jazz violin and guitar.
>> Cheatham, Bechet, Armstongs (Louie AND Lil), Fats Waller, Fatha Hines,
>> Django, Clarence Williams and Women of Jazz
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Dave R
>>
>>
>>


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