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ARSCLIST  April 2016

ARSCLIST April 2016

Subject:

Re: Wet playing (was: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid & Stylus Treatments)

From:

Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 8 Apr 2016 19:29:39 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

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text/plain (519 lines)

Hi Malcolm:

The issue I've had with wet-playing, which I understand can work when the groove is really damaged 
(although I'm not sure exactly why except maybe the mass and resistance of the fluid keeps the 
stylus from jumping out of the groove -- but then why wouldn't heavier VTF solve that problem?), is 
why not just clean the record properly, and then use the appropriate tracking force. I can't see why 
a liquid would improve stylus-groove contact. That said, I know it's worked in extreme cases like 
rare one-of-a-kind 78s that were played to nubs in their previous life.

Does wet-playing cut down on surface noise? If so, why/how? Inquiring minds want to know ...

On a related topic, say I found one of those rare 78's and it was either caked on with mud crud or 
had a paper sleeve stuck to it. Could I soak it in distilled water for a period of time, long enough 
to semi-liquify the stuff in the grooves, and then clean it? Or will soaking it damage the shellac? 
I'm assuming soaking will dissolve or dislodge the record label, but that wouldn't be my major 
concern in such a situation.

-- Tom Fine

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Malcolm" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 7:00 PM
Subject: [ARSCLIST] Wet playing (was: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid & Stylus Treatments)


> Fascinating thread BUT a question arises. How does "wet playing" a vinyl disc affect a stylus? The 
> cartridge?
> I learned the method from an old time DJ and it works wonders when making transfers, but I was 
> told that using it too much will just make the recording become noisy over time. True?
> Strangely I have never lost a cartridge to water or chemical damage in 40 years of wet playing 
> (then again, I use the method sparingly).
> As to cleaning a stylus, a small, soft dry brush, brushing back to front works well for me. 
> Looking at the stylus tip through a  20x magnifier has shown me that sometimes a very fine hair 
> can actually get caught ON the stylus. Much more tenacious that dust, dirt or general schmutz. 
> I've also seen what that gunky mold release chemical can do to a stylus - especially prevalent on 
> mid/late 1950s vinyl 78s.
> And, before somebody gets all het up, I know you should never wet play a shellac record!
> Malcolm
>
> *******
>
> On 4/8/2016 10:26 AM, Tom Fine wrote:
>> Larry, I think the wet cleaners are more of an issue today, as I said, because of the laws in 
>> different parts of the world and the decline of super-strong glues to them being made of noxious 
>> chemicals. Your cleaning method is time-proven, no doubt. I would only say that one should make 
>> sure they have a steady hand and a clear understanding of moving the brush against the stylus in 
>> a direction that will not bend or break the cantilever. Practice will make perfect, and care 
>> should be exercised.
>>
>> Regarding your war stories from the record store, I am sure that dry-brushing didn't work in some 
>> cases. Here's why -- I think -- 
>> someone playing a bunch of un-cleaned records with an un-cleaned stylus is going to get enough 
>> greasy crud buildup that it will sludge and then solidify from the head generated by the added 
>> friction. Once a greasy glob of vinyl dust, finger mung and various other dirt has solidified, I 
>> suspect only a solvent will clean it off a shaped diamond.
>>
>> -- Tom Fine
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Miller, Larry S" <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 3:07 PM
>> Subject: [ARSCLIST] Is a Stylus Cleaning Fluid Necessary & Would Someone Please Test Stylus 
>> Treatments
>>
>>
>>> Tom,
>>>        I don't know if wet versus dry stylus cleaning is a study that will be taken up anytime 
>>> soon, but I can offer my personal observation, not opinion.  For about ten years I worked 
>>> part-time at Needle In a Haystack, a small group of stores in the Washington, DC area, which 
>>> sold, as their name suggests, replacement phonograph "needles," cartridges, and audio 
>>> accessories, such as record cleaning supplies.  As such, over the course of my employment, I 
>>> examined thousands of styli under a microscope.  Typically, I would look at a stylus before 
>>> cleaning it so I could see if the problem was just that it was dirty or missing its diamond tip. 
>>> If the tip was intact, I would clean the stylus, then inspect it for wear.  I can assure you 
>>> that there were many occasions when a dry brush did not do the job, even with repeated strokes. 
>>> I had to use a fluid to remove the debris.  On a busy Saturday I might have to look at more than 
>>> 100 styli, so I could usually skip applying fluid to the brush after the first dozen or so 
>>> because the bristles would remain wet from all the previous drops, but even then there were 
>>> occasions when I had to add a drop to remove stubborn debris.  A dry stylus brush will often 
>>> remove the microscopic equivalents of dust bunnies, but for gunk that seems baked on, which may 
>>> be close to the truth given the estimated temperature at a stylus tip while playing, a fluid is 
>>> necessary, in my experience.
>>>        Here's a method I often use when cleaning a stylus at home, always using a drop of fluid. 
>>> I do not remove the headshell.  For some turntables, there is no removable headshell, but even 
>>> when there is, I prefer this method.  I loosen the tonearm so it's free to move in an upward 
>>> direction. My left hand, I place in a position such that it gently cradles and controls the 
>>> tonearm so it will not get away from me. Holding a stylus brush in my right hand, I move it up 
>>> until the stylus is resting on the bristle pad, then gently pull the brush toward me.  I use my 
>>> left hand to gently hold the tonearm which I reposition the stylus brush and repeat three or 
>>> four times. It takes much longer to explain than it does to do.  The reason I clean my styli 
>>> this way is that letting the tonearm be free, I cannot mash the cantilever against the bottom of 
>>> the cartridge body as I have seen too many people do.  If cartridge designers intended 
>>> cantilevers to be parallel with a record's surface, they would have made them that way.  Using 
>>> my method admittedly requires coordination and entails risk, but it prevents me from putting too 
>>> much pressure on the cantilever.  When done correctly, the stylus simply rests on the stylus 
>>> cleaning brush bristle pad, while I gently pull that towards me.  (This is one reason I really 
>>> like the Discwasher SC-2.  It has a larger bristle pad than most current stylus cleaning 
>>> brushes.)  If I apply too much pressure, the arm moves upward slightly and I know to lighten my 
>>> touch.  My left arm prevents the tonearm from moving laterally.  I also like to have the volume 
>>> turned on slightly so I can hear what's going on.
>>>        I realize my method may not be desirable for most people, but I have used it for decades 
>>> and never broken a stylus while doing so.  But even if they don't adopt my method, I hope they 
>>> will heed this bit of advice.  You're cleaning a stylus, not scrubbing a floor: use as little 
>>> pressure as necessary.  And little is necessary.  If a stylus is proving hard to clean, use more 
>>> strokes, not more pressure.
>>>        So, Tom, for me the question of whether wet stylus cleaning is necessary has been 
>>> answered by years of personal experience with a definite "sometimes."  I would certainly welcome 
>>> a study of various stylus cleaning fluids for the reasons expressed in previous post, but the 
>>> study I wish someone would undertake would be of stylus treatments, such as STYLAST, which 
>>> claims to significantly extend stylus life.  If it does, wouldn't that be of interest to most 
>>> record collectors and sound archives?  We all know that replacement styli are much harder to 
>>> find than they were 20 years ago.  If something could double or even quadruple the life of 
>>> styli, wouldn't that be a good thing for everyone in our community, especially those with 
>>> significant investments in special styli for 78s or lacquers?  Obviously, any such a study would 
>>> have to look at any potentially detrimental effects to vinyl, shellac, lacquer, etc.  I've heard 
>>> some positive anecdotal mentions of STYLAST, but they're just that, anecdotal.  I'd like a 
>>> well-designed scientific study.
>>>        By way of full disclosure, I use STYLAST at home and like it.  I wouldn't want to make 
>>> any comments about whether it does or does not extend stylus life, but I will say that my 
>>> admittedly subjective impression is that when playing LPs, groove noise seems reduced.  Again, 
>>> that's my impression, not a scientifically proven fact, but that would also be something nice to 
>>> test. Also, I feel like my records "sound better" when I use STYLAST.  (Boy, you can't get more 
>>> subjective than that, can you?)  But what I use at home and what can be recommended for archival 
>>> use may be different.  That why I would love for stylus treatments to be tested: the potential 
>>> benefits seem so great: longer stylus life and better sound.
>>>        And, no, I'm in no way affiliated with The LAST Factory, the manufacturer of STYLAST, and 
>>> haven't sold their products since Needle In a Haystack closed its retail operations years ago.
>>>
>>>        The opinions expressed are mine and mine alone.
>>>
>>> Larry Miller
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On 
>>> Behalf Of Tom Fine
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 6:55 PM
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid
>>>
>>> By the way, Larry, you guys at LOC have access to things like powerful microscopes and other 
>>> magnifiers, plus all kinds of measuring equipment. You should study whether a "wet" stylus 
>>> cleaner is required in the first place, also just how much crud a stylus picks up on a 
>>> pre-cleaned disk (I suspect it's enough to justify cleaning the stylus either in an Onzow-type 
>>> resin or with a brush after every platter played). I'd also like to know just how much wear, in 
>>> the form of ground up disk material, is created on each play. I think there is no such thing as 
>>> a wear-free playback except maybe in an industrial clean-room environment after the disk has 
>>> been cleaned to the point of having no loose material anywhere in the groove (again, I suspect 
>>> not possible without a clean-room environment because dust in the air will alight as soon as the 
>>> disk has been wiped or vacuumed). My point is, I think analysis will find that all disk playback 
>>> is somewhat destructive, although I think it can be controlled to the point that a 
>>> well-manufactured disk can withstand dozens if not hundreds of playbacks before it's ruined. In 
>>> short, careful cleaning and storage are mitigators but not total preventers.
>>>
>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Tom Fine" <[log in to unmask]>
>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 6:42 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi Larry:
>>>>
>>>> I did stock up on Discwasher stuff when they started to falter. I just wish I had bought a 
>>>> couple
>>>> of ZeroStat guns back then, when they cost a lot less than the current version. Agree that 
>>>> alcohol
>>>> might not be a good idea on some stylus parts.
>>>>
>>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Miller, Larry S" <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 4:52 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Wow, you still have some of that?  The Discwasher SC-2 stylus cleaner hasn't been available 
>>>>> for,
>>>>> what, twenty years?
>>>>> By the way, it was my understanding from talking with Discwasher personnel back when they were
>>>>> still headquartered in Columbia, Missouri, that their SC-2 stylus cleaning fluid was 
>>>>> essentially
>>>>> a more concentrated version of their D4+ record cleaning fluid, which I took to mean that it
>>>>> would be safe to use D4+ as a stylus cleaning fluid in a pinch.  That's why I made a point of
>>>>> mentioning that the current, black bottle Discwasher D4+ is not the same because it now 
>>>>> contains
>>>>> alcohol which may make it questionable as a stylus cleaning fluid for some brands of 
>>>>> cartridges.
>>>>>
>>>>> The opinions express are mine alone.
>>>>>
>>>>> Larry Miller
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On 
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Tom Fine
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 1:08 PM
>>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid
>>>>>
>>>>> Larry, I never said I used D4+ fluid, I said I used their specific stylus-cleaning fluid, 
>>>>> which
>>>>> came in a little bottle with the stylus brush. It was called SC-2.
>>>>>
>>>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Miller, Larry S" <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 12:15 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Tom,
>>>>>> Two concerns about your mention of using Discwasher D4+ fluid as a stylus cleaning fluid.
>>>>>> Unlike
>>>>>> the original Discwasher D4+ fluid (and the earlier Discwasher fluids) in a red bottle, the 
>>>>>> D4+
>>>>>> fluid in a black bottle now marketed by RCA contains alcohol.  That bottle reads "CAUTION:
>>>>>> Contains Isopropyl (67-63-0)," the latter bit being the CAS Registry Number for isopropyl
>>>>>> alcohol.
>>>>>> This means that there's a risk using it on styli whose manufacturer cautions against that.
>>>>>> Also,
>>>>>> as I recall, the bristles on the Discwasher SC-2 are glued in place with an alcohol-soluble
>>>>>> adhesive.  And from word of mouth, I've heard reports of problems using the new fluid on the
>>>>>> SC-2.
>>>>>> I'm glad you stated the necessity of cleaning a stylus before each use, something I forgot to
>>>>>> mention in my previous post.  Recently, I was looking at an audio forum post in which the 
>>>>>> writer
>>>>>> proudly stated that he cleaned his stylus every 10 plays. That's rather like brushing one's
>>>>>> teeth
>>>>>> after every 10 meals, isn't it?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As always, the opinions expressed are mine alone.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Larry Miller
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of Tom Fine
>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2016 8:29 PM
>>>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just to be clear, I use two methods to clean stylii:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. after each playback, I use the Onzow stylus tip cleaner:
>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/ZERODUST-ONZOW-STYLUS-TIP-CLEANER/dp/B00ERPWAK2
>>>>>> NOTE that these things get less "gooey" over time, a couple of years, and need to be 
>>>>>> replaced.
>>>>>> Also note that they do need to be washed with clean water occasionally. I let mine air-dry
>>>>>> because
>>>>>> I think anything you wipe or pat-dry it with will leave behind fibers in the gooey material.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. I occasionally disconnect the headshell and visually inspect the stylus and cartridge with 
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> magnifier. there's usually some crud that's gotten on the cartridge body or in the groove 
>>>>>> under
>>>>>> which the stylus pivots. I CAREFULLY use canned air if necessary, but prefer to use the 
>>>>>> Ortofon
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> Denon cleaning brushes that come with their cartridges. While the headshell is off, I will
>>>>>> carefully brush the stylus with the old DiscWasher brush, having applied a couple drops of 
>>>>>> their
>>>>>> fluid. I make sure the fluid only touches the stylus itself and perhaps the cantilever, not 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> cartridge body or the area where the cantilever enters the cartridge. As I said before, I 
>>>>>> don't
>>>>>> think any sort of fluid will do any good inside the cartridge or on the glues and resins that
>>>>>> hold
>>>>>> things together.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bottom line, it IS important to clean the stylus after each playback, even if you've cleaned 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> disk. Playback itself is something of a grinding operation (hopefully as little grinding as
>>>>>> possible, but gravity and lack of a dust-free clean room generally do result in a little bit 
>>>>>> of
>>>>>> grinding), so grit will get picked up. I remember ads in old hifi magazines documenting how 
>>>>>> much
>>>>>> visible damage was done by just a little bit of grit, and how quickly a modern, highly 
>>>>>> shaped,
>>>>>> pointy stylus gets worn down if it's grinding through dirt all the time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh, also, I'd probably be less worried about fluid with something like a Shure, 
>>>>>> Audio-Technica,
>>>>>> Denon or Ortofon cartridge because the bodies seem to be made out of thick plastic and there
>>>>>> aren't exposed innards, but I'd still want to use conservative amounts of fluid and restrict 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> application to the stylus itself as much as possible. Some of the really expensive cartridges
>>>>>> have
>>>>>> the whole works right out there in the open air. No way I'd get any sort of fluid near them,
>>>>>> except very carefully applied to the stylus itself. I'd be very careful with a brush, too, on
>>>>>> those cartridges.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Miller, Larry S" <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2016 6:31 PM
>>>>>> Subject: [ARSCLIST] Stylus Cleaning Fluid
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Although personally I think Tom Fine is right to be concerned about the possibility of 
>>>>>>> stylus
>>>>>>> cleaning fluid damaging a cartridge, there is so much conflicting information, it's 
>>>>>>> difficult
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> know what to do.  Inside most stylus assemblies is an elastomer damper surrounding the
>>>>>>> cantilever.
>>>>>>> Some stylus cleaning fluids contain alcohol which can damage that damper.  Alcohol on rubber 
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>> not a good mix.  When that happens, sound quality can deteriorate.  Think of it like this, 
>>>>>>> does
>>>>>>> your car ride better when its shock absorbers are new or when they're worn out?
>>>>>>> Since the stylus and the elastomer damper are on the opposite ends of a cantilever, how does
>>>>>>> alcohol get from one to the other?  It can wick up the cantilever.
>>>>>>> Also, many styli are what's termed a bonded stylus, which means that a small tip of diamond 
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>> glued onto a metal shank as opposed to the more expensive nude mount in which the entire 
>>>>>>> shank
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> tip are one solid diamond.  If that bonding adhesive is alcohol-soluble, the tip may come 
>>>>>>> off.
>>>>>>> On their site, Ortofon states that "The use of solvents on the stylus and cantilever may 
>>>>>>> damage
>>>>>>> stylus cement; interior parts of the cartridge can be affected seriously by the intrusion of
>>>>>>> solvents," and warns that doing so voids their warranty.   (Ortofon does not define what
>>>>>>> constitutes a solvent.)  Instead, they recommend using a carbon fiber brush, pictured here:
>>>>>>> http://www.ortofon.com/stylus-brush-carbon-fibre-p-451-n-3444
>>>>>>> On the other hand, in their document, "Frequently Asked Questions About Phono Cartridges," 
>>>>>>> Van
>>>>>>> den
>>>>>>> Hul recommends using alcohol (49 Q), instead warning to avoid using stylus cleaning fluid
>>>>>>> contaminated with oil (50 Q) which can deteriorate the epoxy used on bonded styli.  However,
>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>> do admit that stylus cleaning fluid can "creep along the cantilever and finally reach and
>>>>>>> attack
>>>>>>> the suspension rubber(s)."
>>>>>>> http://www.vandenhul.com/faq/general/phono-cartridges-faqs
>>>>>>> In a 2008 response to a customer's question about cleaning styli, Shure recommends "a 
>>>>>>> mixture
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> 50% ethyl alcohol (or denatured alcohol) and 50% distilled water, and a soft camle [sic] 
>>>>>>> hair
>>>>>>> brush."
>>>>>>> http://shure.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/1558/~/stylus-cleaning-fluid
>>>>>>> For ten years, I worked part-time at a small chain of stores that sold replacement 
>>>>>>> phonograph
>>>>>>> styli and audio accessories.  There, I examined thousands of styli under a microscope and it
>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>> my experience that, in some cases, a stylus could not be cleaned unless I used a fluid.
>>>>>>> I think the problem is that all cartridge manufacturers may not use the same adhesive on 
>>>>>>> their
>>>>>>> bonded styli or the same elastomer material for their dampers.  So a stylus cleaning fluid 
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> may be safe for one brand, may be detrimental to another.  From a warranty situation, it 
>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>> seem the most prudent choice would be to follow the manufacturer's recommendation.
>>>>>>> As for the choice of applicator, for me, a densely packed bristle brush is the way to go.  I
>>>>>>> never
>>>>>>> had much luck with soft bristle brushes like the one Shure recommends.  Sometimes they work,
>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>> other times the bristles are so pliable they bend around a stylus without removing the gunk
>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>> it.  My favorite stylus cleaning brush is the Discwasher SC-2 with the large, walnut wood
>>>>>>> handle,
>>>>>>> partly because I have large hands and find the handles on many of the currently available
>>>>>>> stylus
>>>>>>> cleaning brushes too tiny.  Sadly, the SC-2 is long discontinued, but one can still find 
>>>>>>> these
>>>>>>> at
>>>>>>> yard sales or on ebay.  Some pictures of an SC-2 can be found at this link, near the bottom 
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> page. http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/167704/using-a-lp-stylus-brush
>>>>>>> By the way, the first brush pictured, the one with the red, U-shaped handle, is neither a
>>>>>>> stylus
>>>>>>> cleaning brush nor a record cleaning brush.  It was, in fact, intended to clean a Discwasher
>>>>>>> record cleaning brush pad when it got dirty.
>>>>>>> If you have an SC-2 and want to periodically clean it, you can soak it in warm water with
>>>>>>> barely
>>>>>>> enough dishwashing detergent to form a little suds, followed by a thorough rinse.  Do NOT 
>>>>>>> try
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> clean it with alcohol because it's my recollection that the glue used to hold its bristles 
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> place is alcohol-soluble, so the bristles could start falling out.
>>>>>>> Ultrasonic stylus cleaners can work and are a good choice for those who are nervous about
>>>>>>> dragging
>>>>>>> a brush across such a fragile and expensive thing. Usually, all you have to do is to gently
>>>>>>> lower
>>>>>>> the stylus onto a small pad.  However, I do have one horror story to share.  A customer came 
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> for a replacement stylus for his brand new cartridge. When I asked what happened, he said 
>>>>>>> he'd
>>>>>>> lowered his tonearm onto the cleaning pad, then tried to slide the switch of the ultrasonic
>>>>>>> cleaner to "On."  Unfortunately, when the switch offered more resistance than expected, he
>>>>>>> pushed
>>>>>>> it a little harder and the cleaner jumped away from him snapping the cantilever like the
>>>>>>> fragile,
>>>>>>> expensive twig it was.  After that $100 mistake, he would turn on the cleaner before 
>>>>>>> lowering
>>>>>>> his
>>>>>>> stylus onto it.  He's a better man than I.  After that experience, I'm afraid that cleaner
>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>> have had an unfortunate encounter with a ball peen hammer.
>>>>>>> I wish I could advise Tom Fine that he could safely and definitively do this or that.  His
>>>>>>> concern
>>>>>>> is valid, but the proffered solutions seem all over the place.  But I can say this, you have 
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> clean your stylus because it's more expendable than your recordings and to not clean it 
>>>>>>> risks
>>>>>>> permanent damage to them.  Odds are, you can replace your stylus or even your cartridge more
>>>>>>> easily and less expensively than your record collection, so you gotta take the risk and 
>>>>>>> clean
>>>>>>> it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The opinions expressed, especially advocating the use of ball peen hammers on so-called
>>>>>>> innocent
>>>>>>> inanimate objects, are entirely mine alone.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Larry Miller
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
>>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>>> Of Clark Johnsen
>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2016 7:23 PM
>>>>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Cleaning stylus
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'd worry not about anything falling apart, but about the solvent migrating up the 
>>>>>>> cantilever
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> inside the cartridge, where stuff is a lot more delicate.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 14, 2016 at 7:15 PM, Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I agree that's a good one. Can you get the fluid anymore?
>>>>>>>> Another good one is the LAST cleaner -- some sort of smelly solvent
>>>>>>>> with a nail polish brush.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shai Drori" <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2016 6:55 PM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Cleaning stylus
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have been using the Discwasher stylus brush that came with my kit
>>>>>>>> that I
>>>>>>>>> bought around 1986. Still works wonders.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>> Shai Drori
>>>>>>>>> Expert digitization services for Audio Video Hi Res scanning for film
>>>>>>>>> 8mm-35mm www.audiovideofilm.com [log in to unmask]
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jan 15, 2016 at 1:50 AM, Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Don't you have to submerge the stylus assembly in liquid to do an
>>>>>>>>>> ultrasonic cleaning? I'd worry that they whole thing would fall
>>>>>>>>>> apart, definitely possibility that the diamond would get rattled
>>>>>>>>>> loose or fall off.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I've used this thing for years:
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/ZERODUST-ONZOW-STYLUS-TIP-CLEANER/dp/B00ERPWAK
>>>>>>>>>> 2 does remove grime that brushes won't, does not damage the stylus.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Steve knows this, but to those less familiar with record playing --
>>>>>>>>>> the best way to preserve your stylus AND your records is to clean
>>>>>>>>>> the records correctly before you play them.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -- Tom Fine
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Smolian"
>>>>>>>>>> <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2016 3:28 PM
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [ARSCLIST] Cleaning stylus
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Has anyone cleaned styli and cantilevers ultrasonically and, if so,
>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> what results?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Steve Smolian
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
> 

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