GW,

The chemical composition of the shellac-based plastic used in 78s has been
a subject of interest since the industry's earliest days. Many times, these
formulations were closely held as Trade Secrets; in other instances, there
was a carelessness that led to their not having been preserved.

DDR

On Wed, Nov 30, 2022 at 4:08 PM Railroads On Parade <
[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> ARSDL
> It is my intention to find pertinent information about the specific
> composition of material used to make these 78 rpm discs.
> If you have the name of a book or library or librarian or scientist or
> chemist, anyone with that kind of knowledge I'd be most obliged.
> It is that simple.
> I've seen some very personal quips and back and forth at this Discussion
> List and would like it to remain a positive source for me.
> Thank you,
> Guy Walker
>
> On Wed, 30 Nov 2022 at 16:02, Railroads On Parade <
> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> > DDR,
> > I'm writing about the "post 2nd WW grunge" Dave Deihl replied about.
> > GW
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 30 Nov 2022 at 16:00, Railroads On Parade <
> > [log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >
> >> DDR
> >> I just read the email I sent to a Columbia University graduate and they
> >> understood completely.
> >> GW
> >>
> >> On Wed, 30 Nov 2022 at 15:59, Dennis Rooney <[log in to unmask]>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I am not sure what you mean by "bookish comprehensive resolve" but with
> >>> respect to Columbia vs. Victor:
> >>>
> >>> Munves's observation referred to production at the two labels. Until
> >>> 1939,
> >>> when it was purchased by CBS, the Columbia Phonograph Co. had a rather
> >>> high
> >>> quality product that didn't sell as well as Victor. Immediately
> following
> >>> the sale, the plating in the three-step metalwork of post-1939
> Columbias
> >>> was cheapened and the introduction of mastering on 33-1/3rpm acetate
> >>> lacquer blanks made the subsequent development of a long-playing record
> >>> possible in 1947-48, but the dubbing of every approved take from slow
> >>> speed
> >>> to 78rpm master resulted in an inferior sounding product, and Columbia
> >>> 78s
> >>> from U, S. metals all sounded inferior until the format was abandoned
> in
> >>> 1952. Matrices of European manufacture, however, did not have this
> >>> problem.
> >>>
> >>> Victor's "gold" then "white gold" pressings exhibit a similar decline
> in
> >>> manufactured quality which, fortunately, was limited to pressing
> quality,
> >>> particularly the "wartime" pressings. Vinylite was introduced into the
> >>> RCA
> >>> biscuit immediately after WW2 and their discs from that period are
> >>> quieter,
> >>> but are frequently bad sounding due to the label's mistaken use of
> audio
> >>> limiting in the mastering process.
> >>>
> >>> Columbia's success with the Lp and its marketing strategy led to a
> rapid
> >>> improvement in the label's sales and production quality. Hence, the
> >>> second
> >>> part of Peter Munves's observation.
> >>>
> >>> Ciao,
> >>>
> >>> DDR
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Nov 30, 2022 at 6:36 AM Railroads On Parade <
> >>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > Mr. Diehl,
> >>> > What is the compositional makeup of post war grunge?  I'm pretty
> >>> familiar
> >>> > with what Carnegie did with the RCA Z recordings, but I've never seen
> >>> > anybody breakdown what was being watered down and/or what was being
> >>> added
> >>> > or subtracted.
> >>> > The RCA exec R. Peter Munves once told me that Columbia was not so
> >>> good,
> >>> > and then it was good, then it was not so good and RCA was better here
> >>> than
> >>> > there, but I have never gotten any more than that.  I can see and
> feel
> >>> the
> >>> > difference between Columbia gold band and grey, I can hear
> differences
> >>> in
> >>> > HMV pressings and Columbia made in France, I am just at a dead end in
> >>> any
> >>> > bookish comprehensive resolve.
> >>> > GW
> >>> >
> >>> > On Tue, 29 Nov 2022 at 21:45, David Diehl <
> >>> > [log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> > > The Haven sessions were re-released on Chronological Classics 1253.
> >>> They
> >>> > > sound pretty clean to me, maybe dubs of test pressings but not
> >>> typical
> >>> > > post-war 78 grunge.
> >>> > >
> >>> > >  David Diehl
> >>> > >
> >>> > > -----Original Message-----
> >>> > > From: Mickey Clark <[log in to unmask]>
> >>> > > To: [log in to unmask]
> >>> > > Sent: Tue, Nov 29, 2022 7:49 pm
> >>> > > Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] acetate and vinylite
> >>> > >
> >>> > > Hi Guy - I think it would be worth your while to try a transfer
> with
> >>> a
> >>> > > VRII
> >>> > > cartridge. Some records that sound terrible with a stereo cartridge
> >>> can
> >>> > > sound flawless with a true mono cart-Mickey Clark
> >>> > >
> >>> > > -----Original Message-----
> >>> > > From: Railroads On Parade
> >>> > > Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2022 2:08 PM
> >>> > > To: [log in to unmask]
> >>> > > Subject: [ARSCLIST] acetate and vinylite
> >>> > >
> >>> > > After searching around for a good sounding Bill De Arango/Ben
> >>> Webster 78
> >>> > > Mr.Brim and Dark Corners it occurred to me that after listening to
> >>> one on
> >>> > > youtube as rough sounding as mine, and the only transcription I
> have
> >>> been
> >>> > > able to find, a better transcription might not exist.  I don't see
> >>> the
> >>> > > recordings were ever transferred (please prove me wrong) but what
> >>> also
> >>> > came
> >>> > > to mind is, the different formulas (I assume) of acetates, shellacs
> >>> and
> >>> > > vinylite and any documentation of what they were and who used them
> >>> and
> >>> > > when?
> >>> > > My copy and the one on youtube both appear to the eye as new, but
> >>> sound
> >>> > as
> >>> > > if they are not.  It simply comes to mind that maybe the mix of the
> >>> stuff
> >>> > > used to press the disc was inferior?
> >>> > > Guy Walker
> >>> > >
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> 1006 Langer Way
> >>> Delray Beach, FL 33483
> >>> 561.265.2976
> >>>
> >>
>


-- 
1006 Langer Way
Delray Beach, FL 33483
561.265.2976