Print

Print


The formalized mapping of retired code to new codes into which it is split 
will persist, and is formalized in the retired code elements mappings 
download file. IT systems should be able to make use of this mapping 
without confusing the use of the macrolanguage to reflect a real world 
reality (whether ethnic, governmental or other) that groups the languages 
as a single unit.

-Joan



Peter Constable <[log in to unmask]> 
Sent by: ISO 639 Joint Advisory Committee <[log in to unmask]>
2007-07-10 08:11 PM
Please respond to
ISO 639 Joint Advisory Committee <[log in to unmask]>


To
[log in to unmask]
cc

Subject
Re: First round of changes for ISO 639-3 review period over






Wrt changing a split & retired item to be a macrolanguage, the issue isn’t 
necessarily just about whether the item, e.g. “Southern Zhuang”, would be 
a good choice for a macrolanguage entry. There’s also the fact that *the 
item exists* in the code set, it’s denotation includes multiple individual 
languages, it itself was deemed in some contexts (all past usage) to be an 
individual language, and IT systems may need the formalized relationship 
of the macrolanguage mapping to match requests for “Southern Zhuang” with 
records in “Dai Zhuang” (or vice versa). 
 
In the particular case of Southern Zhuang, it may be sufficient to include 
the new items into the “Zhuang” macrolanguage. In the general case, 
though, I’m inclined to think we ought to give a bit more thought to how 
such splits should be handled in this particular regard.
 
 
Peter
 
From: ISO 639 Joint Advisory Committee [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf 
Of Joan Spanne
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 2:28 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: First round of changes for ISO 639-3 review period over
 

Thanks, Peter, for your response. 

With regard to history, the pattern of showing history for retirements is 
already visible, as with the case of all the retirements associated with 
Occitan, e.g., 
http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/documentation.asp?id=auv 
All the retired code elements will have similar history trails, including 
the change request documentation leading to them (not present here, since 
this was a JAC decision). 

With regard to splits, no, there are no plans for macrolanguages, just 
straight retirements with remedy being to choose which of the two or more 
new languages is the appropriate code element. I discussed the matter of 
macrolanguages with those for which it might have been relevant, and each 
requester said that the macrolanguage situation did not seem to apply. 
Their mere relatedness is not grounds for a macrolanguage, in light of the 
upcoming part 5. 

The 5 individual languages into which Southern Zhuang is being split will 
be added to the Zhuang macrolanguage group of which Southern Zhuang was a 
part. I should have included that in the report. 

A few other change requests related to code elements that are members of 
macrolanguages, but they do not affect mappings, except to remove a 
retired code element from its group in one case. Other cases are name 
changes only. 

I think that covers Peter's concerns on all but Valencian. 

-Joan 

  


Peter Constable <[log in to unmask]> 
Sent by: ISO 639 Joint Advisory Committee <[log in to unmask]> 
2007-07-10 01:26 PM 


Please respond to
ISO 639 Joint Advisory Committee <[log in to unmask]>



To
[log in to unmask] 
cc

Subject
Re: First round of changes for ISO 639-3 review period over
 








Thanks for the report. I’ve commented on Catalan/Valencian in a separate 
thread. I’ll comment on other changes here: 
  
-          2 additional names for entries in Parts 2 and 3: I see no 
particular problem with accepting these. 
  
-          14 “retirements” in Part 3: My only concern is that 
documentation gets added for each deprecated entry referring users to the 
entry into which it has been merged. 
  
-          8 splits to items in Part 3: Can I assume your intent is that 
the existing items all take on scope of macrolanguage and get mappings to 
the new encompassed elements? (Out of curiousity, do we end up with any 
two-level macrolanguage-mapping hierarchies as a result – i.e. a 
macrolanguage that has a mappings to another encompassed macrolangauge?) 
  
-          50 new entries for Part 3: My only concern is that care is 
taken to deal with any macrolanguage mappings that may be need to be 
added. 
  
-          49 name changes in Part 3: I see no particular problem with 
accepting these. 
  
  
Peter 
  
From: ISO 639 Joint Advisory Committee [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf 
Of Joan Spanne
Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 2:54 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: First round of changes for ISO 639-3 review period over 
  

Hello All, 

The first round of change requests for ISO 639-3 underwent review from 
April 1 - June 30. As expected, not many received any comments, though the 
Valencian request received 43 comments alone (5 other change requests 
received one comment each), about 1/4 opposed and 4/5 in favor (including 
a form letter sent in by 9 people). 

I am attaching a document that is my report on the changes, with summaries 
and recommendations. Three code elements affected are in both Part 2 and 
Part 3. The changes to these are summarized first in the report. The rest 
of the report contains summaries of all other changes (those affecting 
only Part 3). 

Obviously action on the three code elements in both parts will require 
agreement of the JAC. In addition, though, I would appreciate a review of 
the other proposed changes, as it is just possible that one or more of 
them might have some effect on Part 2 that I had not foreseen. 

To see the actual change request documentation, use this pattern for the 
link: 

http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/chg_detail.asp?id=2006-129 
where the parameter at the end is the change request number. 

In order to minimize delay in posting the results of the requests (at 
least for those only pertaining to part 3), I would appreciate a response 
by July 18th, if possible. Debate on the Valencian - Catalan matter may 
take longer, of course. For more on that matter, please see my message 
dated 13 Apr 2007. 

Thanks, 

Joan Spanne
ISO 639-3/RA
SIL International
7500 W Camp Wisdom Rd
Dallas, TX 75236
[log in to unmask]