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Rebecca S. Guenther wrote:
> In MODS we considered that people might be using different rules for what
> is considered a surname and would use the appropriate entry element for
> their context. So that, as stated below, the "De" could be part of the
> surname or included at the end of the given name ("de"). 

But the original posting indicated that in their rules, the "de" is not 
correctly either part of the surname nor part of the forename. 
Presumably this affects ordering of records and retrieval. (I'm guessing 
that the order is Jan Koning or Koning, Jan even though the display is 
Jan de Koning.) So putting it in one or the other of the name parts will 
not work.

> In response to an earlier comment by Karen Coyle, we already have an
> element under <name> for <displayForm>.

It seems like this is a problem that will come up for the Virtual 
International Authority File -- there won't be just one display form, 
but different display and access forms of the same name based on who is 
entering the name in the file.

> 'If a surname includes an article or preposition [...], enter under the
>> element most commonly used as entry element [...] Dutch. If the surname
>> is Dutch, enter under the part following the prefix unless the prefix is
>> 'ver'. In that case, enter under the prefix.
>>
>>
>> (I have to admit, these rules being Anglo-American, they may not be the
>> best; later on they say: 'Flemish. See Dutch.')

Right, those are Anglo-American cataloging rules. So if someone is using 
a different set of rules (and many are) then they may need different 
name parts.

Of course what this comes back to is that using the name itself as the 
only way to identify the author means that we don't have a universal way 
to say that we are talking about the same author even though we write 
that author's name differently. We are desperately in need of author 
identifiers so that everyone can have their "native" view of how names 
are written and how they will be accessed, but we can know that my 
Koning, Jan de is the same as Thomas' Koning Jan <de>.

kc

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Karen Coyle / Digital Library Consultant
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