That's the article I remember! Unfortunately, my High Fidelity mags from that timeframe are library-bound, so impossible to scan the article. Any chance you can scan it, Roger, so we can get it put somewhere for public consumption? -- Tom Fine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Kulp" <[log in to unmask]> To: <[log in to unmask]> Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 2:00 AM Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] 16 2/3 Prestige There was quite an article about them in High Fidelity when they first came out in 1957.Something about "There's a long,long play" in the title.It had a nice picture of Rudy Van Gelder,and the cutting lathe. Roger --- On Sun, 10/4/09, Michel RUPPLI <[log in to unmask]> wrote: From: Michel RUPPLI <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] 16 2/3 Prestige To: [log in to unmask] Date: Sunday, October 4, 2009, 11:28 PM Hi Tom and other members, As far I remember, the info I collected on the Prestige 16 2/3 came from a catalogue where they wefre listed. I have not invistagated more on that series, as I was primarily interested in session contents, and lesser on records which reproduced them - although it was evident I had to list all singles and albums whicb were made available to general public. Then I have no info on Prertige policy about that series nor on its production and use I have not specially researched other labels having produced 16 2./3 records. However the Vogue label in France produced such records. They had a 9 in a 7 in. series and 7 in a 10 in. series, according to the catalogues I used). Both were primarily made of reissues (popular dance music - generally selections of various Vogue artists, including popular French jazz artists of the time like Sidney Bechet who was living in France). Michel Ruppli Le 4 oct. 09 � 19:42, Tom Fine a �crit : > > Bonjour Michel: > > Do you recall, from your discography work, if any other jazz labels did these slow-speed records? > Any idea why Prestige? Also, did anyone except Van Gelder master these things? I have to dig out > that old article, when I get a chance, but as I recall it, Prestige was marketing these records as > a discounted music medium (ie twice the tunes for the same price as an LP), not as a specialized > thing for a specialized jukebox. > > Did this ever catch on with spoken-word labels? It seems that would be the natural market for this > medium -- two hours on one 12" record, the ability to fit a whole play or short book into a 2-LP > gatefold instead of a box. Also reissues of mono opera recordings? > > -- Tom Fine > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michel RUPPLI" <[log in to unmask]> > To: <[log in to unmask]> > Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 1:33 PM > Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] 16 2/3 Prestige > > > Remember that my Prestige discography (Greenwood Press - 1980) listed > the Prestige 16 2/3 LPs series, including: > 3 Miles DAVIS (contents identical to Albums PRLP 7109 + PRLP7150) > 5 George Walington/Phhil Woods (same contents aa New Jazz albums NJLP > 8207 + NJLP 8304) > No info available on 7 and 8 when I researched that series in early 70s. > Michel Ruppli > ------- > Le 3 oct. 09 � 21:22, Michael Biel a �crit : > >> >> Tom Fine wrote: >>> I read an article about 16 2/3 RPM LPs, I think in an old High Fidelity or HiFi Review. It was a >>> short fad, right? I think Prestige and some other jazz labels reissued very old mono titles in >>> discounted double-length records. If I recall the article correctly, Rudy Van Gelder was the guy >>> who cut those records, and he talked about how it was somewhat of a challenge but do-able. The >>> reviewer agreed that old mono jazz could successfully be reissued in that medium. >>> >>> Anyone know how long that fad lasted and how many records were issued in that format? >>> >>> -- Tom Fine >>> >> I hesitate to change the subject line because apparently my previous shorter answer to this was >> not seen in another subject head. In 1958 Vox issued 8 and Prestige issued 6 (?) 12-inch 16 2/3 >> XLPs that were all mastered by Rudy Van Gelder. I have three of the Vox, and I have never seen >> any others anywhere except these three in the warehouse of the record distributor where I worked >> in 1966 and gave them to me as unsalable. "The Long Player" and "Jazz and Pops" catalogs listed >> them in a special section for about a year, and I suppose this means that Sam Goody's was trying >> to sell them! If I had more time I'd check when they entered and left the catalog, but this is >> wha16t 1was there in the 2nd half of 1958. >> Prestige >> 1 Concorde -- Modern Jazz Quar, Milt Jackson Trio >> 2 Let's Get Away From It All -- Billy Taylor 4 Three Trombones -- Jay Jay Johnson, Kai Winding, >> Bennie Green >> 5 Modern Jazz Survey -- NY Jazz >> 6 Modern Jazz Survey -- Baritones & French Horns >> 8 Miles Davis and the Modern Jazz Giants >> I have no idea what happened to 3 or 7. 5 & 6 didn't appear until the Oct 58 catalog. >> >> Vox >> VXL-1 Tchaikovsky Piano Con 1, Romeo & Julie, Sym 6 >> VXL-2 Beethoven Emperor and D Maj Violin Cons, Corioian & Leonore Overs >> VXL-3 L'Arfesienne 1&2, Polovetsian, Scheherazade, Nutcracker S. >> VXL-4 Geo Feyer -- Round the World, Round the Clock >> VXL-5 Syms: Beethoven 5, Dvorak 5, Prokofiev 1, Schubert 8 >> VXL-6 Piano Cons: Grieg, Liszt 1, Rach 2, Schumann >> VXL-7 Dance Party -- Barreto, Monese, Sandauer >> VXL-8 Violin Cons: Tsch, Paganini 1, Mendelssohn, Bruch 1 >> >> Mike Biel [log in to unmask] >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Nelson" <[log in to unmask]> >>> To: <[log in to unmask]> >>> Sent: Friday, October 02, 2009 11:42 PM >>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Living Presence promo copies >>> >>> >>> The Seebug juke box company made a "library" unit that played 12" lps. The unit was designed to >>> play 33s or 16 2/3 rpm music discs. >>> 16rpm 12" discs were released by Decca records, mostly bacground music type. >>> dnw >>> >>> --- On Fri, 10/2/09, Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> >>>> From: Tom Fine <[log in to unmask]> >>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Living Presence promo copies >>>> To: [log in to unmask] >>>> Date: Friday, October 2, 2009, 12:49 PM >>>> Hi Larry: >>>> >>>> That sounds like a cool toy! Wow, that must have been a >>>> 70's thing, the golden age of albums. When you sat down and >>>> listened to an album one side at a time. We're back to the >>>> pre-album days again in popular music, one song at a time. >>>> >>>> Music servers are slowly becoming a mainstream component. >>>> There will be a day when someone combines something like >>>> that into a genuine jukebox interface and they'll have >>>> themselves a nice niche product. There are already plenty of >>>> virtual jukebox interfaces, but I'm talking about the real >>>> thing, including the neon lighting and the pushbuttons. >>>> >>>> -- Tom Fine >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry S Miller" <[log in to unmask]> >>>> To: <[log in to unmask]> >>>> Sent: Friday, October 02, 2009 3:30 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Living Presence promo copies >>>> >>>> >>>> Tom, >>>> Do you know about LP jukeboxes? Not the kind >>>> that plays 7-inch 33-1/3 discs, but the type that plays >>>> full-sized 12-inch LPs. I've encountered only a >>>> couple, one in a long-gone restaurant near the Mizzou campus >>>> called the Agora House. Not only were the enchiladas >>>> good, for, I believe, a quarter, I could hear an entire side >>>> of 'The Doors" or "Surrealistic Pillow." Probably not >>>> the sort of thing you'd want to put your shaded dogs on, but >>>> if you had a Dynaflex re-issue of something, who >>>> cares? By the way, I think it had a Shure cartridge. >>>> >>>> Larry Miller >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> For a long time, I had dreams of a classic 45-singles >>>> jukebox, but then when I started shopping for >>>> a well-restored one, it turned out they mostly sound like >>>> crap due to both mid-grade to low-grade >>>> phono pickups and also the fact that most singles sound >>>> like crap from Play One. So net-net, I >>>> decided that they're great for noisy bars and diners but >>>> not so much for focused listening at home. >>>> I admit still being thrilled when I come upon one that >>>> still works in a bar or diner. The first >>>> thing I do is feed it dollars so I can sample its contents. >>>> Nowadays, if you find it working, it's >>>> usually on its last legs and the records are circa early >>>> 1990's or earlier. No interest in or use >>>> for CD jukeboxes; I remember when those first came out, >>>> higher prices per play and less fun to use. >>>> Plus much less frequent switch-ins of music, at least in >>>> the upstate NY market, so the whole purpose >>>> of a jukebox was being defeated. It went from a >>>> music-discovery machine to an oldies and stale hits >>>> machine. >>>> >>>> -- Tom Fine >>>> >>> >>> >> >