Gail and Wayne
 
We are hoping that issues like this will be addressed if our RDA change proposals, 6JSC/BL/3 and 6JSC/BL/4, are approved by JSC in November - see  http://www.rda-jsc.org/workingnew.html
 
6JSC/BL/3 would admit other terms indicative of of rank, honour or office (LC have responded to this proposal and I've already redrafted it, for greater clarity).
 
6JSC/BL/4 would expand the definition of Other designation associated with the person.
 
If approved, one or the other of these should capture the terms of address and clan names that you refer to.
 
Regards
Richard
_________________________
Richard Moore
Authority Control Team Manager
The British Library
                                                                       
Tel.: +44 (0)1937 546806                               
E-mail: [log in to unmask]                           

 



From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gao, Gail
Sent: 10 September 2012 14:53
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Examples of upgraded NARs with $c

Hi, Wayne,

 

I think you're right to use $c religious rand/title when date is not available. But in this case, "$c da shi" is not a religious rank or title. It's simply a respectful address to someone who is respectable.

 

As to the Mongolian clan names, we have similar dilemma in Chinese Buddhist names. Quite a number of people converted to Buddhism would adopt the last name "Shi" of Sakyamuni, the founder of Buddhism. Actually "Shi" is neither a religious title nor a rank. It's a clan name. We can't find an exact category to fit in. As a result, we have a lot of "$c Shi" in NARs. I have no clue how we can deal with this clan name issues in future RDA.

 

I hope I have partial answers to your question(s).

 

Gail

 

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Wayne Richter
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2012 5:24 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Examples of upgraded NARs with $c

 

Gail,

 

Thank you for the example. I do have one question.  As someone who has upgraded many NARs I realize that the $d is usually preferred over $c. If the date hadn’t been available wouldn’t $c da shi have been acceptable under RDA 9.19.1.2 c)?

 

Thanks to Hideyuki Morimoto for pointing out this example.

 

One reason for my inquiry is I am encountering and adding information to  more and more NARs which have the 667 "THIS 1XX FIELD CANNOT BE USED UNDER RDA UNTIL THIS RECORD HAS BEEN REVIEWED AND/OR UPDATED". I almost all cases the “offending” $c is a clan name. Clan names are frequently an important part of Mongolian names since there aren’t family names. I’m sure clan names are also important in other cultural traditions.

I guess I’m trying to wrap my head around where these fit in RDA (9.6?)  and how these would be treated when converting them to RDA.

 

Thank you for any help.

 

Wayne Richter

Asian Materials Specialist/PCC Liaison

The Libraries

Western Washington University

Bellingham, WA 98225-9103

ALCTS CC:AAM

 

 

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gao, Gail
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2012 1:39 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Examples of upgraded NARs with $c

 

Hi, All,

 

I personally converted one record to RDA. The original record had 667 " THIS 1XX FIELD CANNOT BE USED UNDER RDA UNTIL THIS RECORD HAS BEEN REVIEWED AND/OR UPDATED" and the heading was "Xinyun, $c da shi." It has been changed to "Xinyun, $d 1927- ." LCCN n 85047431.

 

I also attached the original for reference.

 

Gail Gao

Cataloger of China Section

Library of Congress

 

 

 

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Mark Ehlert
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2012 3:53 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Examples of upgraded NARs with $c

 

Benjamin A Abrahamse <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

One that I ran across the other day: ARN 08783993; LCCN: n 2011180633

100:1x:$a Babcock, Philip S., $c Ph. D.


That one hasn't been flipped yet.  Wayne's looking for a record that has been revised to the RDA standard and the 667 removed in the process.

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