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if RDF is going to be used exclusively, but if you have N-triples and JSON
in the mix as container formats ... different issue.

And no, they aren't RDF's problems, RDF in XML format inherits a lot of
features from XML and can leverage off ITS etc. Likewise RDF in HTML5 guise
can leverage off internationalisation features in HTML5 or HTMLNext (Living
HTML or whatever its called this week). The issues are more related to
bibframe and the conversion process from MARC formats to Bibframe
regardless of the container.

For instance RDF and XML would use one system for language tagging a
record, and MARC and possibly. Bibframe use a different system for tagging
the language of the item/object being described.

Two different functions and two different language tag schemes ... BCP47 vs
ISO-639-2 (B)

And in theory the record might consist of multiple "language" tags since in
script and romanisation would be different language tags in the BCP-47
sense.

This level of complexity would become an issue when records are being
transformed into XML or HTML5 formats to be used by user agents, since
accessibility requirements will kick in in various jurisdictions.

It will also impact on font rendering of content, in IE10 and latest
versions of Firefox content marked up with a language tag of "tr" will kick
in The Turkish language system in the font if present in the fonts OT
tables, etc.

At least that's my high level tack on it.

In MARC-8 and MARC-21 you didn't have to concern yourselves with this, they
essentially lived in isolation. In theory internationalisation was based on
a 40+ year old model.

But RDF in XML, RDF in HTML5, N-triple and JSON each bring their own
requirements to Bibframe;

As do the programming languages used;

Accessibility requirements;

etc.

Bibframe is movement into a model where there are many inter-dependencies
and external requirements on the model. Going from an isolated industry
standard to leveraging off international standrads

Andrew






On 8 January 2013 13:36, Ross Singer <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Why are they issues, though?  They're RDF's problems, not Bibframe's.
> Isn't that part of the point of using existing standards?
>
> -Ross.
>
>
> On Monday, January 7, 2013, Andrew Cunningham wrote:
>
>> Although those legacy encodings specific to the library industry would
>> not exist in Bibframe
>>
>> Ultimately the issues are more related to how the parsed content is going
>> to be consumed or going to be used. If it is to be human editable or
>> presented to user agents then more complex processing that inserts markup
>> or formatting control characters that are not present in the MARC records
>> would sometimes be required.
>>
>> A lot of this is just tip of the iceberg ... esp if transforming to
>> HTML5, language tagging in the record versus language tagging of the
>> record, and a range of other issues.
>>
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>> On 8 January 2013 12:36, Ross Singer <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> On Monday, January 7, 2013, Andrew Cunningham wrote:
>>
>> Just reading through Roy Tennant's article at
>> http://www.thedigitalshift.com/2013/01/roy-tennant-digital-libraries/library-of-congress-bibframe-initiative-part-2/
>>
>> And it got me to thinking, a point quoted in the article was that each of
>> the implementations is doing different transformations on the MARC records
>>
>> The second point is that RDF/XML, N-triples and JSON formats are
>> supported.
>>
>> One markup format, one plain text format, one javascript format.
>>
>> Which got me to thinking, each of these formats has different
>> requirements; for instance:
>>
>> * RDF/XML would use markup where N-triples and JSON would use Unicode
>> Formatting Control Characters.
>>
>> * RDF/XML and N-triples would reference characters outside the Basic
>> Multilingual Plane directly as characters or as six digit hexadecimal
>> numerical entities, while JSON requires to four digit hexadecimal numerical
>> entities representing UTF-16 surrogate pairs.
>>
>> * RDF/XML can use characters directly or XML/HTML style hexadecimal or
>> decimal numerical character references or named entities (e.g. &#x0100;)while JSON requires javascript nuerical entities ,e.g. \u0100; finally
>> N-triples is more agnostic but has some interesting requirements, e.g.
>> requires support for all Unicode characters and references charmod, and
>> indicates a preference for actual characters over escaped characters,
>> except where required by the encoding.
>>
>> So different intermediation processing of characters maybe required for
>> each format, as well as logic to handle markup versus Unicode format
>> control characters.
>>
>> If this makes sense?
>>
>>
>> It does, but I'm not sure why it matters?  It's all RDF and presumably
>> one would be using RDF parsers to handle the character encodings.
>>
>>  I mean, we deal with this already with MARC8, UTF-8 (in MARC-21), and
>> MARCXML. It's only really a problem because we use encodings that nobody
>> else in the world uses so we have to come up with our own parsers and
>> serializers (and, in many languages, MARC-8 support is just ignored).
>>
>> The RDF community is already dealing with this (plus other
>> serializations), so I don't really see how this is an issue.
>>
>> Although, admittedly, I may be missing your point here.
>>
>> -Ross.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 8 January 2013 08:55, Andrew Cunningham <[log in to unmask]>wrote:
>>
>> I hate to tell you this but numbers aren't language neutral.
>>
>> But there are bigger internationalisation issues and potentially a lot of
>> things that bibframe will inherit from parent markup standars including
>> language tagging, bidi, encoding requirements, variatiin selectors, its,
>> etc.
>>  On 08/01/2013 8:42 AM, "J. McRee Elrod" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> Andres Cunniungham said:
>>
>> >Although, my primary interest and concern is the internationalisation
>> >architecture that will underly Bibframe.
>>
>> Moving from language neutral numbers to English based html markup is
>> hardly a move towward internationalisation.
>>
>>
>>    __       __   J. McRee (Mac) Elrod ([log in to unmask])
>>   {__  |   /     Special Libraries Cataloguing   HTTP://www.slc.bc.ca/
>>   ___} |__ \__________________________________________________________
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Andrew Cunningham
>> Project Manager, Research and Development
>> Social and Digital Inclusion Team
>> Public Libraries and Community Engagement
>> State Library
>>
>>


-- 
Andrew Cunningham
Project Manager, Research and Development
Social and Digital Inclusion Team
Public Libraries and Community Engagement
State Library of Victoria
328 Swanston Street
Melbourne VIC 3000
Australia

Ph: +61-3-8664-7430
Mobile: 0459 806 589
Email: [log in to unmask]

http://www.openroad.net.au/
http://www.mylanguage.gov.au/
http://www.slv.vic.gov.au/