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Ross,

Well said. I think we have a need at least to try to interpret the records based on their actual declared value, but actual practice can sometimes get in the way.  To that end, we are actually developing a "raw" transform and an enhanced one, that adds additional services like code lookups, links to ID, etc.  That module is more geared to what LC thinks the data looks like in our systems. Maybe the punctuation treatment can be part of that, or at least parameterized in the first, raw transform.

It might take some doing to modularize particular enhancements, but worth the effort. 

In my opinion, if I'm digging into a MARC record anyway, I might as well do everything I can to clean it up and make it consistent with current practices and  understanding, before passing it on. Wasted opportunity, otherwise.

"[from old catalog]" anyone?

Nate



-----Original Message-----
From: Bibliographic Framework Transition Initiative Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ross Singer
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 10:43 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [BIBFRAME] Punctuation

On Jan 29, 2013, at 10:25 AM, Kelley McGrath <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Like many things, this is not so simple in practice. The meaning of 245$b depends on the preceding subfield (often, but not always $a). Preceded by : it's a subtitle. Preceded by = it's a parallel title. Preceded by ; it's a second title (another work) by the same person or people as the title in $a. In addition, you can have ISBD punctuation within the subfield for parallel titles or more titles by the same person/people.
> 
Although I think this screams of the need to actually use a defined vocabulary for these semantics and not packing that onto the last character of the preceding subfield.

http://rdvocab.info/Elements/parallelTitleProper
http://rdvocab.info/Elements/titleProper
http://rdvocab.info/Elements/otherTitleInformation
http://rdvocab.info/Elements/parallelOtherTitleInformation
...
etc.

-Ross.

> Kelley
> ________________________________________
> From: Bibliographic Framework Transition Initiative Forum 
> [[log in to unmask]] on behalf of Trail, Nate [[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 6:59 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [BIBFRAME] Punctuation
> 
> If it's in a MARC record, there's no need to guess, because the subfields are already parsed parts. Title proper is 245$a, subtitle is 245$b, etc.
> Nate
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> Nate Trail
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> Network Development and MARC  Standards Office Technology Policy Mail 
> stop 4402 Library Services Library of Congress
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> [log in to unmask]
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: J. McRee Elrod [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 5:22 PM
> To: Trail, Nate
> Cc: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [BIBFRAME] Punctuation
> 
> 
>> Maybe I'm missing something, but if we capture each subelement in it's
>> own property, there'd be no need to parse a long string with ISBD
>> punctuation.You'd know exactly what was in each, even if you didn't
>> have a display system.
> 
> If it is in Chinese characters,  I don't know where the place ends and the publisher begins, nor where the title proper ends and subtitle begins.  I only got up the 300 characters and gave up.
> 
> 
>   __       __   J. McRee (Mac) Elrod ([log in to unmask])
>  {__  |   /     Special Libraries Cataloguing   HTTP://www.slc.bc.ca/
>  ___} |__ \__________________________________________________________