Print

Print


Hi:

I'm sorry to say I didn't notice this posting by Curtis until this morning.

To me, this proves the folly of super-dry storage. It doesn't seem to mitigate or prevent 
sticky-shed and it's probably destructive to acetate-backed tapes and some early polyester-backed 
tapes.

-- Tom Fine

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Peoples, Curtis" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Monday, April 01, 2013 5:00 PM
Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Sticky SHRED


> We have stored our tapes for ten years in an environment averaging 68 degrees F and a RH of about 
> 33%.  It used to take 4-6 hours to bake a tape. We are now at 8 hours. I  am interested to know 
> why these tapes are now taking longer.
>
> Curtis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf 
> Of Tom Fine
> Sent: Monday, April 01, 2013 3:42 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Sticky SHRED
>
> Any theories as to why baking times are increasing?
>
> Also, are you finding you need the longer baking times for re-bakes as well as first-time bakes?
>
> -- Tom Fine
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Marie O'Connell" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Monday, April 01, 2013 3:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Sticky SHRED
>
>
> Hi Shai
>
> No, I don't find it alarming at all.  I have been baking for longer periods
> now for a few years as 8 hours just wasn't enough and I had to keep putting
> the reel back in the oven.
>
> Cheers
> Marie
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 9:32 AM, Shai Drori <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Hi Marie
>> Do you find this as alarming as I have that baking times have risen so
>> high in the last few years? My record was set last year with Ampex 480
>> quarter inch 2500' tapes needing 5 days to be playable. Really slowed down
>> operations.
>> Cheers
>> Shai
>> בתאריך 01/04/13 9:15 PM, ציטוט Marie O'Connell:
>>
>>> I agree with Richard.  I have seen quite a bit of this recently with Ampex
>>> 456.  And it does make a real mess.  I am also finding BASF and AGFA doing
>>> this too.  They all appear to be slightly too wide for the tape path.
>>>
>>> I have been baking for much longer periods also, 3 days would be normal
>>> for
>>> me now.
>>>
>>> Good luck.
>>>
>>> Marie
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 5:40 AM, Richard L. Hess <[log in to unmask]
>>> >**wrote:
>>>
>>>  Hi, Curtis,
>>>>
>>>> I've been baking longer, but edge shedding as you describe is common if
>>>> the tape is slit a bit wide (hard to measure, but that is why the event
>>>> is
>>>> so random--it might be one reel out of a jumbo roll where the slitting
>>>> blades were mis-adjusted).
>>>>
>>>> I don't think 24 hours (my norm these days) would show a difference as I
>>>> saw this off some 1/2-inch 456 just recently, but it was only the edge.
>>>>
>>>> It is frightening, but I'd just vacuum up the little hairs and be done
>>>> with it. Remember, those are about a mil wide and you're dealing with
>>>> nominally 82-mil (minimum spec'd is 75 mil from Ampex) track width that
>>>> doesn't even go completely to the edge, so you probably don't have any
>>>> sound on the little hairs. (I did want to write "hares" in honour of the
>>>> season. <smile>)
>>>>
>>>> I would check for debris in the corners of the guides (where the face
>>>> meets the top and bottom caps) which can exacerbate this hair-shred but,
>>>> overall, if it's coming just from the edges, I think you're safe.
>>>>
>>>> I see 456 doing this more (though I've seen it more on 1/2-inch than
>>>> 1/4-inch). It has also happened on Agfa and BASF, but not regularly.
>>>>
>>>> I don't have this variant specifically listed, but you might find this
>>>> resource of use:
>>>> http://richardhess.com/notes/****formats/magnetic-media/**<http://richardhess.com/notes/**formats/magnetic-media/**>
>>>> magnetic-tapes/analog-audio/****degrading-tapes/<http://**
>>>> richardhess.com/notes/formats/**magnetic-media/magnetic-tapes/**
>>>> analog-audio/degrading-tapes/<http://richardhess.com/notes/formats/magnetic-media/magnetic-tapes/analog-audio/degrading-tapes/>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Good luck!
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> Richard
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 2013-04-01 12:10 PM, Peoples, Curtis wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  Hi Richard,
>>>>>
>>>>> I believe the tape is Ampex 456, not positive though. The studio
>>>>> generally bought Ampex 456 tape. It is a ten inch, quarter inch reel
>>>>> (two
>>>>> track master recording). For this collection, we bake 8 hours at 130
>>>>> degrees. We have found this to be a suitable process for this
>>>>> collection.
>>>>>   The shredding appears to be from the edges. We are transferring on a
>>>>> relatively new Otari MX 5050. The machine was cleaned so I don't have
>>>>> pics
>>>>> of the shred. They are usually about 3 inches long before breaking and
>>>>> are
>>>>> about the thickness of fine hair.
>>>>>
>>>>> Best,
>>>>>
>>>>> Curtis
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List [mailto:
>>>>> [log in to unmask]**GOV <[log in to unmask]>] On Behalf Of
>>>>> Richard L. Hess
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 01, 2013 10:48 AM
>>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Sticky SHRED
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi, Curtis,
>>>>>
>>>>> Please provide specifics as to type of tape, width, reel type, baking
>>>>> process and duration.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also photographs are really useful.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is the shredding from the edges only or across the entire width of the
>>>>> tape?
>>>>>
>>>>> What is the playback machine?
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>
>>>>> Richard
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2013-04-01 10:35 AM, Peoples, Curtis wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  Hi Folks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We have a collection of tapes that have sticky shed and we are baking
>>>>>> and transferring them. Things are going as planned except for one
>>>>>> tape. It
>>>>>> is shredding into fine hair like stands. I thought it needed to be
>>>>>> baked
>>>>>> longer so I baked it a second time. Same problem. I have seen tape shed
>>>>>> before and this looks different.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any help identifying the problem is greatly appreciated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Curtis L. Peoples, Ph.D.
>>>>>> Associate Archivist, Crossroads Music Archive,
>>>>>> www.crossroadsofmusic.ttu.edu<****http://www.**crossroadsofmusic.<http://www.crossroadsofmusic.>
>>>>>> **ttu.edu/<h**ttp://www.crossroadsofmusic.**ttu.edu/<http://www.crossroadsofmusic.ttu.edu/>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unit Head, Crossroads Recording Studio,
>>>>>> http://library.ttu.edu/****crossroadsrecordingstudio/<http://library.ttu.edu/**crossroadsrecordingstudio/>
>>>>>> <htt**p://library.ttu.edu/**crossroadsrecordingstudio/<http://library.ttu.edu/crossroadsrecordingstudio/>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> Director, TTU Americana Ensemble,
>>>>>> http://ttuamericanaensemble.****weebly.com/index.html<http://weebly.com/index.html>
>>>>>> <http://**ttuamericanaensemble.weebly.**com/index.html<http://ttuamericanaensemble.weebly.com/index.html>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Contact Info:
>>>>>> Southwest Collection, Texas Tech University P. O. Box 41041 Lubbock,
>>>>>> Texas 79409-1041
>>>>>> Email: [log in to unmask]
>>>>>> TEL: 806-742-3749 ext. 278
>>>>>> FAX: 806-742-0496
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  --
>>>> Richard L. Hess                   email: [log in to unmask]
>>>> Aurora, Ontario, Canada                             647 479 2800
>>>> http://www.richardhess.com/****tape/contact.htm<http://www.richardhess.com/**tape/contact.htm>
>>>> <http://www.**richardhess.com/tape/contact.**htm<http://www.richardhess.com/tape/contact.htm>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> Quality tape transfers -- even from hard-to-play tapes.
>>>>
>>>>
>> --
>> בברכה,
>> שי דרורי
>> מומחה לשימור והמרה של אודיו וידאו וסרטים 8-35 ממ.
>>
>