This strikes me as an eminently reasonable approach. Much more accurate and time-saving than entering an AAP as a string, after already entering the various portions of it as separate elements.

Jean Harden
Coordinator of Music Technical Services
University of North Texas
Denton, TX  76203
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(940) 369-7178

-----Original Message-----
From: Bibliographic Framework Transition Initiative Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Deborah Fritz
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2014 8:02 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [BIBFRAME] bibframe editor

On the question of the AAP field, just to let you know, the approach of the RIMMF [1]  RDA editor to generating an AAP (for as long as we have pre-composed AAPs in the RDA model) is to auto-compose the AAP from the identifying elements that are provided for the entity, but only when an 'AAP checkbox' is ticked for an applicable element, i.e., using a mixture of machine and human composition. 

For a Work, 'Preferred Title for the Work' is ticked by default to be included in the AAP for the Work; and the first listed 'Creator' is also ticked by default. Other attributes for which data has been provided can then be manually ticked to have the data for those attributes added to the AAP. 

So, in the example that follows, 'Author' and 'Preferred Title for the Work'
were both ticked by default, and the AAP was auto-composed from that element data (using a default order). Although 'Date of Work' data was provided as an attribute (because it was known), that attribute will not appear in the AAP unless and until it is manually ticked: 
Author:  			Bryson, Bill  	 [X]
Preferred Title for the Work:  	A short history of nearly everything     [X]
Date of Work: 			2003      [ ]

Authorized Access Point:  	Bryson, Bill. A short history of nearly

Note that the data in the 'Author' element for the Work, is itself an AAP from the related Person entity data, and that AAP was auto-composed in the same way in that data: 
Preferred Name for the Person:  	 Bryson, Bill   [X]
Date of Birth:  				 1951	 [ ]

Authorized Access Point:        		 Bryson, Bill   

This means that any changes to the 'Author' AAP for the Work cannot be made in the Work data itself-those changes must be made to the data provided for the Person. 

So, if for some reason we decide to add 'Date of Birth' data to the AAP for the 'Author' element in the Work data, we would make that change in the AAP that is provided for the Person data (just by ticking the 'Date of Work'):
Preferred Name for the Person:  	 Bryson, Bill   [X]
Date of Birth:  				 1951	 [X ]

Authorized Access Point:        		 Bryson, Bill , 1951- 

That change then immediately flows through to the data used for the 'Author'
element provided for the Work, which in turn automatically updates the AAP for the Work: 
Author:  			Bryson, Bill, 1951-  	 [X]
Preferred Title for the Work:  	A short history of nearly everything     [X]
Date of Work: 			2003      [ ]

Authorized Access Point:  	Bryson, Bill, 1951- A short history of
nearly everything

We have Dave Reser to thank, for suggesting this 'checkbox' approach. 

For a version of this message showing screenshots of RIMMF data, instead of text, go here:


-  -  -  -  -  -  -  -
Deborah Fritz
TMQ, Inc.
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-----Original Message-----
From: Bibliographic Framework Transition Initiative Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Trail, Nate
Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2014 4:50 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [BIBFRAME] bibframe editor

Joyce, thanks for this detailed feedback. You are describing a number of enhancements/issues that can be, as you say, addressed by developing local profiles. We are developing a profile editor to facilitate that. Beyond that, this is a good list of issues we can tackle. We spent very little energy on the user experience, in favor of getting major components like the ability to look up various terms, and your suggestions on lookups is helpful.

On the question of the AAP field, I think it's a matter of policy. For some institututions, the AAP is a very long string, including many differentiating parts, in order to make the string unique in that institution. It would not be hard for a system to have rules for which fields to combine in which order, but deciding that is not something we can do in a generic editor.

Thanks again,

Nate Trail
LA308, Mail Stop 4402
Library of Congress
Washington DC 20540

-----Original Message-----
From: Bibliographic Framework Transition Initiative Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Joyce E. Bell
Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2014 5:17 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [BIBFRAME] bibframe editor

The testing group at Princeton looked at the editor as a functional tool for doing their work and provided a number of comments which are summarized in the text below.

Joyce Bell
Cataloging and Metadata Services Director Princeton University Library


Catalogers do not take well to the bibframe editor in its current structure.
Some of the complaints they have center around features which could be accommodated by local profiles (display labels, presence of elements) while other complaints are a bit more fundamental.

Separating the input form into separate sections for work, instance and holdings seems like forcing the bibframe model on inputters when most (maybe
all?) of this distinction can happen behind the scenes and the cataloger does not need to even be aware of it.  It makes sense for the order of elements on the form to match the order in which data tends to be encountered on material rather than forcing a cataloger to jump around following the bibframe model.

Popup boxes are time-consuming and distracting.  For example: in the instance I click on "provider entity" for publication.  A popup box appears.
I want to put in the provider's name so I click on organization for the provider's name.  Now I am in a second popup box.  There is potential for
yet a third popup box if I want to fill in the authority assigner.    By the
time I click on that I have completely lost track of what I started doing.

Why do we have a box for the aap?  This should be generated by taking data from other fields in the form. Since RDA still uses the concept of a main entry that combined with the title forms the aap, the editor should allow us to specify the name that is the main entry.  Doing so would allow for auto-generation of the app and less duplication of data.  [Or we change RDA?]

Visually the editor is troublesome.  Elements are spread out requiring a lot of scrolling.  The labels can be very confusing.  When a data element is set, very little of it is visible.  Some of the elements are not repeatable yet they have to be set and then aren't editable without clicking them open, editing them, then setting them again.

There are some bugs.  If a subject is mistakenly added as the wrong type-place, for example, when it should have been topic-it must be deleted and added as the correct type.  This is a far cry from changing 651 to 650.
The editor does not allow you to edit the lookup form of an instance title (and since you can only view 15 characters, you can't see properly what was chosen).  Are you supposed to go to the work lookup, which you can edit, to see the full data?

Lookups for names or subjects using keyword functionality often makes finding the right heading impossible.  Trying to set the subject for "London (England)" I simply can't get that option to appear unless I type in "Londinium" which I happen to know is a variant name.  Lookups are also less than satisfactory when you need to view the authority record to choose the correct entity.

The form structure is inconsistent.  For subjects, authors and editors the form provides a row of buttons from which you choose the type.
Classification has separate row for each defined type of classification.  In all cases the links lead to the same form no matter what type is chosen.  If any differences are hidden behind the scenes, why not simplify the form?

LC, DDC and NLM classifications should have lookups.

ISBN popups should auto-populate the scheme.

The form doesn't allow for inputting of parallel fields for alternate scripts.