On 1/30/15 6:58 PM, Tim Thompson wrote:
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Karen,

Aren't the semantics behind MARC just the semantics of card catalogs and ISBD, with its nine areas of bibliographic description? ISBD has already been published by IFLA as a linked data vocabulary (http://metadataregistry.org/schema/show/id/25.html)--although, sadly, they left out the punctuation ;-)

Tim
The semantics of MARC are funky because of the way that things like indicators interact with subfields in fields, etc. Take a look at my analysis and you'll understand.

MARC goes way beyond ISBD -- by far.

Note also that ISBD is deeply flawed. ISBD has its nine areas of description. Each area begins with ". -" Not all nine areas are required therefore you can have:

.- area 1
.- area 3
.- area 9

or

.- area 1
.- area 2
.- area 4

What a machine sees is:

.- area?
.- area?
.- area?

From a data processing point of view, this is not helpful. There may be a way to determine which area you have, but the model does not clearly distinguish them. Human eyes and brains are needed.

kc



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--
Tim A. Thompson
Metadata Librarian (Spanish/Portuguese Specialty)
Princeton University Library

On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 9:01 PM, Young,Jeff (OR) <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
What if it was two different vocabularies, rather than two different levels of abstraction?

There is only one reality. A rose by any other name would smell as sweet. :-)

Jeff



> On Jan 30, 2015, at 8:02 PM, Martynas Jusevičius <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> Karen,
>
> lets call those specifications BM (BIBFRAME MARC) and BLD (BIBFRAME
> Linked Data).
>
> What I meant is two different levels of abstractions, each with its
> own vocabulary and semantics. And a mapping between the two, for which
> SPARQL would be really convenient.
>
> In the 2-tier approach, these are the main tasks:
> 1. convert MARC data to RDF at the syntax level (BM)
> 2. design semantically correct bibliographic Linked Data structure (BLD)
> 3. define a mapping from BM to BLD
>
> So in that sense I don't think it is similar to profiles, as profiles
> deal with a subset of properties, but they still come from the same
> vocabulary.
>
> A somewhat similar approach is W3C work on relational databases:
> 1. direct mapping to RDF: http://www.w3.org/TR/rdb-direct-mapping/
> 2. customizable declarative mapping to RDF: http://www.w3.org/TR/r2rml/
>
>
> Martynas
> graphityhq.com
>
>> On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Karen Coyle <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> Martynas,
>>
>> I agree that the requirement to accommodate legacy MARC is a hindrance to
>> the development of a more forward-looking RDF vocabulary. I think that your
>> suggest of using SPARQL CONSTRUCT queries is not unlike the concepts of
>> selected views or application profiles -- where you work with different
>> subsets of a fuller data store, based on need.
>>
>> I wonder, however, how an RDF model designed "from scratch" would interact
>> with a model designed to replicate MARC. I know that people find this to be
>> way too far out there, but I honestly don't see how we'll get to "real" RDF
>> if we hang on not only to MARC but to the cataloging rules we have today
>> (including RDA). We'd have to start creating natively RDF data, and until we
>> understand what that means without burdening ourselves with pre-RDF
>> cataloging concepts, it's hard to know what that means.
>>
>> All that to say that I would love to see a test implementation of your idea!
>>
>> kc
>>
>>
>> On 1/30/15 9:03 AM, Martynas Jusevičius wrote:
>>
>> Hey,
>>
>> after following discussions and developments in the BIBFRAME space, it
>> seems to me that it tries to be too many things for too many people.
>>
>> I think many of the problems stem from the fact that (to my
>> understanding) BIBFRAME is supposed to accommodate legacy MARC data
>> and be the next-generation solution for bibliographic Linked Data.
>> Attempting to address both cases, it fails to address either of them
>> well.
>>
>> In my opinion, a possible solution could be to have 2 tiers of RDF
>> vocabularies:
>> - a lower-level one that precisely captures the semantics of MARC
>> - a higher-level one that is designed from scratch for bibliographic Linked
>> Data
>>
>> The conversion between the two (or at least from the lower to the
>> higher level) could be expressed simply as SPARQL CONSTRUCT queries.
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>
>>
>> Martynas
>>
>>
>> --
>> Karen Coyle
>> [log in to unmask] http://kcoyle.net
>> m: +1-510-435-8234
>> skype: kcoylenet/+1-510-984-3600


-- 
Karen Coyle
[log in to unmask] http://kcoyle.net
m: +1-510-435-8234
skype: kcoylenet/+1-510-984-3600