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I hope BIBFRAME or whatever other standard-to-replace-MARC materializes
might use the edges/connections between subjects and objects to describe
relationships like "successor to" or "spurious". I envision such edges as
verbs, or possibly adjectives, to the nouns of subjects. Wishful thinking,
but no more unreasonable than hoping subject experts will actually have the
resources to use this structure (time being the most precious of our
resources).

On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ted P Gemberling <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> I strongly support Teague Allen’s “do no harm” rule. Don’t create
> authorities if you are not confident they’ll be correct.
>
>
>
> However, let me say that I don’t see that as meaning you have to aim for
> absolute perfection. Here’s an example of the difference that I think could
> be helpful. Last weekend I created a personal name authority and added it
> to a bib record. The bib record is OCLC #14804848, and the authority is for
> Lenoir, Olivier, ǂd 1867-1922 (no2016069415). You notice, on that
> authority, that all I put in a 670 is that the heading occurs in OCLC
> (twice before I used it, to be exact). I did not put anything on the
> authority from the book, such as its statement that he was the author’s
> student, because I am not 100% sure it is the same Olivier Lenoir. I think
> it probably is, because Olivier Lenoir medical books start about the date
> of this work, in 1899. (To be exact, they start in 1898 with his thesis). I
> think the creation of the authority is adequately justified by the
> existence of that heading in OCLC, showing that someone, probably in a
> French library, had information on the life dates of someone by that name
> who wrote on medicine. If you’re going to put Olivier Lenoir on the bib
> record at all, you might as well conjecture that it could’ve been this
> person. Eventually, a researcher may determine that it wasn’t. That might
> motivate a cataloger to create an authority for the correct person. But I
> don’t think the presence of this AAP on the bib record is going to ruin
> someone’s research. It may lead them down a blind alley at some point, but
> that’s outweighed by the opportunity it creates for researchers to learn
> more about the person who lived from 1867 to 1922. For example, it will
> make them want to find this book and see if it provides more information
> about him.
>
>
>
> Someone might have ideas about things I could’ve added to the authority to
> indicate my doubts about the identification.
>
>
>
> Another thing that I think mitigates the error with the Potomac Canal
> Company is that a cataloger doesn’t have to use the heading. I can easily
> imagine a cataloger working on a book and saying to himself, “I see
> references to the Potomac Company and the C. & O. Canal Company. I notice
> Potomac Canal Company is supposed to be intermediate, but I don’t see
> evidence of that in the book,” and deciding not to use it in his bib
> record. So the consequences of an error may not be catastrophic.
>
>
>
> Since the system makes it difficult to change or delete AAP’s, I think
> Teague’s suggestion that we should be able to mark a relationship as
> spurious is worth considering. I also think Stephen’s suggestion of the
> qualifier (Proposed), as well as Chris’s idea that it could only be for
> subject use, might be good.
>
>
>
> Ted Gemberling
>
>
>
> *From:* Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:
> [log in to unmask]] *On Behalf Of *Chris Baer
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 25, 2016 11:06 AM
> *To:* [log in to unmask]
> *Subject:* Re: [PCCLIST] Bad metadata
>
>
>
> Not entirely.
>
>
>
> First, we have been collecting and recording the names of businesses and
> business people for 50 years outside of NACO, almost always from primary
> sources.  Years ago we built a data base of all transportation enterprises
> between New York and Virginia down to the Civil War, compiled from the
> session laws of the states and official reports, so it was easy to spot a
> mistake.  The existing 670 didn’t really enter into it much, because I had
> better trust in our data base.
>
>
>
> I gave this as a very, very simple example to show what happens when
> people act in haste outside their area of expertise and why the rule to “do
> no harm” is a very good one.  I was also trying to show how increasing the
> number and types of linkages under RDA multiplies both the chance for error
> and the amount of work necessary to correct it. This one was a straight
> chain of three, and no AAP’s had to be changed.  Unfortunately, the NACO
> data base is full of even more complex mix-ups.  I am in no position to do
> that much.  My employers are not going to pay me to do something that has
> no payoff for them.  All I can do is protect my own local catalog.
>
>
>
> Regarding Teague Allen’s good remarks, I should add that if you want to
> have a system that does more than disambiguate books and authors and that
> is supposed to link up with other expert communities, then things will have
> to pass at least limited muster with those communities.  Unfortunately, I
> am more pessimistic that this can be done, because such expert knowledge
> tends to be very dispersed.  That is why I seconded Ted’s point that
> perhaps you are trying to do too much, admirable perhaps, but beyond the
> means at everyone’s disposal.
>
>
>
> Chris Baer
>
>
>
> *From:* Program for Cooperative Cataloging [
> mailto:[log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>] *On Behalf Of
> *John Wright
> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 24, 2016 4:37 PM
> *To:* [log in to unmask]
> *Subject:* Re: [PCCLIST] Bad metadata
>
>
>
> Ben, Your observation is spot on.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Program for Cooperative Cataloging [
> mailto:[log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>] *On Behalf Of
> *Benjamin A Abrahamse
> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 24, 2016 1:44 PM
> *To:* [log in to unmask]
> *Subject:* Re: Bad metadata
>
>
>
> It sounds like the system is working. Maybe not as infallibly as some
> would like, but still. Someone created an authority record that was, to the
> best of their knowledge, accurate. But their knowledge was faulty. So
> someone else came along, with better knowledge and/or more time to do
> research, and corrected it. Moreover since the first person kindly left a
> 670 sourcing their decisions, the latter fellow was able to spot where the
> error originated.
>
>
>
>
>
> Benjamin Abrahamse
>
> Cataloging Coordinator
>
> Acquisitions and Discovery Enhancement
>
> MIT Libraries
>
> 617-253-7137
>
>
>