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Hi Clark et al
Thank you for your response!  I hope you're still in the vicinity to hear my response, (I've been away from the internet for a few days).
I also have to disagree on both counts, my first statement is NOT a mere assertion, (see below), and the second IS true.  I don't know what your background is, I worked for CBC radio music for almost 40 years.  During that time I had many vinyl enthusiasts declaring that vinyl was superior to CD for the reasons expressed previously; so I undertook an experiment - a blind test, (not double blind since I obviously knew what they were listening to).  I was in a CBC studio and had a few vinyl enthusiasts to listen to comparisons.  Unknown to them, I WASN'T comparing LPs to CDs, but LPs to their master tapes; since these were my own recordings I had access to the master analog tapes.  The material I used included a Beethoven String Quartet, a Mozart Wind Serenade, a Choral work and a World famous soprano soloist.  In the case of the last example, a concert was recorded and subsequently, permission was received to release it on LP.  So in this case, the original first generation master tape was recorded at 7 1/2 ips.  When we mastered it for LP, I dubbed that tape to a 15 ips tape for editing and mastering.  For the comparison, I used this 15 ips tape, not the original 7  1/2 ips master.  As you can probably guess, the candidates INVARIABLY chose the LP which had audible surface noise as sounding superior to what they thought was a CD but was in fact the master analog tape.  In one case, one of the "victims" said, "You can hear the warm ambience as soon as the stylus touches the disc."

I rest my case - at least until someone chooses to argue it.
Regards!db 

    On Friday, August 26, 2016 3:48 PM, Clark Johnsen <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
 

 To David Burnham:

A nay and a yay:

*  This "ambience" is nothing more than the sound of stylus against groove
walls - it has nothing to do with the original recording.  I have no doubt
that these enthusiasts would prefer the sound of an LP to the sound of the
master tape from which it was made.*

Beg to differ with both parts. The first is a mere assertion, the second is
simply untrue.

* Many if not most 78s from the pre-tape era are also direct to disc
recordings so if you have a good copy and good equipment to play it on, a
78 will give better reproduction than any subsequent mastering efforts.*

Quite right!

Clark

On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 12:39 PM, DAVID BURNHAM <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> I think the question comes down to do you want reasons to keep CLASSICAL
> vinyl, as opposed to other genres on vinyl or reasons to keep classical
> VINYL as opposed to CDs or whatever.  As all collectors know, there are
> those who worship vinyl as a medium and feel that it is so superior to
> other media, and those who think those collectors should belong to the flat
> earth society of audio.  Vinyl DOES have its advantages, mainly that the
> highest frequency harmonic content is more accurately reproduced than on
> CDs; this is because the highest frequency harmonic content is so low in
> level compared to the main body of the audio signal and therefore there are
> very few bits available to accurately reproduce it.  It is in this area
> that SACDs are so superior.  Many vinyl enthusiasts love the "ambience"
> around the music that is missing on CDs.  This "ambience" is nothing more
> than the sound of stylus against groove walls - it has nothing to do with
> the original recording.  I have no doubt that these enthusiasts would
> prefer the sound of an LP to the sound of the master tape from which it was
> made.
> As opposed to many 78s, the main characteristic of LPs that lowers their
> status as a medium is that, aside from the few direct to disc recordings
> that have come out, they are all two or more generations removed from the
> master recording and it is that master that, as long as it's preserved,
> will keep the recordings alive.  Many if not most 78s from the pre-tape era
> are also direct to disc recordings so if you have a good copy and good
> equipment to play it on, a 78 will give better reproduction than any
> subsequent mastering efforts.
> db
>
>    On Friday, August 26, 2016 11:22 AM, Benjamin Roth <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
>
>  Greetings everyone.
>
> I need some help in convincing someone to keep a collection of classical
> vinyl.
>
> ASAP!!!  Please!
> Ben Roth
> '
>
>
>
>