And it seems that the FAQ does not apply to Fidel Castro, because it talks about references from the AACR2 form, and Castro’s record was already RDA when the death date was added. Was this person at LC saying that a reference should be added WHENEVER death dates are added? I hope not!! I certainly haven’t been doing it. Amy From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Moore, Richard Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2016 8:59 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] n 50083205 and adding Jr. when upgrading names That FAQ is long overdue for updating. It’s riddled with obsolete references to AACR2 and the LCRIs. Para 10. is also out of date, as the change to hyphens was made programmatically some time ago. Regards Richard ________________________ Richard Moore Authority Control Team Manager The British Library Tel.: +44 (0)1937 546104 E-mail: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Adam L. Schiff Sent: 01 December 2016 13:51 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] n 50083205 and adding Jr. when upgrading names The previously established form should also be recorded in a 4XX field. Over the weekend I closed out Fidel Castro's dates, and earlier this week I was contacted by LC because I did not include a reference from the former form. I did not think such a reference was normally made, but I was pointed to the FAQ on personal names: https://www.loc.gov/aba/pcc/naco/personnamefaq.html#13<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.loc.gov_aba_pcc_naco_personnamefaq.html-2313&d=CwMGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=Dc2zJWQZhGVM4krkr2m4NTiSqZ5Ld3IvJ8wM_1HzJMc&m=nnPlAnXcWn6PEoV6ssvr3LV4fe9hYbWjWj1CRSeipwc&s=AMKKIPXIYdFHUqDmSpSN6PAGY7900YHsdsQpR5lWqhQ&e=> Example 2 AACR2: 100 1 $a Walter, David, ‡d 1948- RDA: 100 1 $a Walter, David, ‡d 1948-2012 400 1 $a Walter, David, ‡d 1948- $w nne a) Date of death added and record recoded to RDA b) Reference is valid under RDA So, your record should probably look like this: 100 1 Espenshade, Edward B., ǂc Jr., ǂd 1910-2008 375 Males $2 lcdgt 377 eng 378 $q Edward Bowman 400 1 Espenshade, Edward Bowman, ǂd 1910- ǂw nnea Note that the fuller form of name should have been recorded in 378 as above. I updated the 375 to reflect current PCC policy to prefer controlled vocabulary for this element, and the recommendations that PCC Policy Committee have recently approved from the ad hoc group on coding gender: http://www.loc.gov/aba/pcc/documents/PoCo-2016/Gender_375%20field_RecommendationReport.pdf<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.loc.gov_aba_pcc_documents_PoCo-2D2016_Gender-5F375-2520field-5FRecommendationReport.pdf&d=CwMGaQ&c=imBPVzF25OnBgGmVOlcsiEgHoG1i6YHLR0Sj_gZ4adc&r=Dc2zJWQZhGVM4krkr2m4NTiSqZ5Ld3IvJ8wM_1HzJMc&m=nnPlAnXcWn6PEoV6ssvr3LV4fe9hYbWjWj1CRSeipwc&s=crBBEa-AC30JF36LpEZFhypc8VyCj9eQyzjkAyaEpA0&e=> Finally, I believe that the coding of the $w in the 400 in this case should be nnea because there's no evidence that the name without Jr. in it represents usage of the person, so in this case the previous AACR2 form is not a valid reference in RDA. Adam Schiff University of Washington Libraries ________________________________ From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> on behalf of John Hostage <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2016 4:49:18 PM To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: n 50083205 and adding Jr. when upgrading names Not only is Jr. part of Espenshade's preferred name, but the evidence in the 670s indicates that his name is Edward B. Espenshade, Jr. In other words, his middle name should be represented by an initial. As Bob indicated, when making a change to an authorized access point, you have to evaluate the name as to whether it reflects the preferred name according to RDA. Older authority records like this are especially likely to deviate from that standard, even if they have been coded RDA by machine. Also, best practice is to put 040 $e before $c for consistency. ------------------------------------------ John Hostage Senior Continuing Resources Cataloger Harvard Library--Information and Technical Services Langdell Hall 194 Harvard Law School Library Cambridge, MA 02138 [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> +(1)(617) 495-3974 (voice) +(1)(617) 496-4409 (fax) ISNI 0000 0000 4028 0917 ________________________________ From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [[log in to unmask]] on behalf of Shorten, Jay [[log in to unmask]] Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2016 18:09 To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]> Subject: [PCCLIST] n 50083205 and adding Jr. when upgrading names I recently closed n 50083205 Espenshade, Edward Bowman, ‡d 1910- , which was already coded as the RDA form, to Espenshade, Edward Bowman, ‡d 1910-2008 . It has been pointed out to me that the source I quoted and some bibliographical records have “Jr.” as part of the name. Should I therefore have upgraded the name to Espenshade, Edward Bowman, ‡c Jr., ‡d 1910-2008 ? I had the idea somehow that when closing dates, if the name is indicated to be RDA or RDA-compatible, for the sake of not making needless changes, you accept the name heading as is and you don’t completely re-cast the name into an RDA form unless there is either an error in the name or the date or it has the dreaded 667 note. e.g. In adding the death date to Espenshade, Gilbert H. ‡q (Gilbert Howry), ‡d 1912- you would not re-cast the name as Espenshade, Gilbert H., ‡d 1912-1992, even though that is a valid RDA form, since the current form is equally valid under RDA. But if it turned up that he was born in 1913 or that his middle name was Lowry and not Howry, then you could re-cast the name to Espenshade, Gilbert L., ‡d 1913-1992. So I guess another of asking this question is: Is the absence of “Jr” in the name considered an error? 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