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This whole issue of CD-Rs and DVD-Rs being reliable for archiving
precious files is driven by the multi-billion dollar wedding
video-graphy business. This is an outright scam when the recording
media wont even last the lifetime to show one's kids let alone the
grand-kids. The other maxim is to keep the original recordings be they
film or tape. And duplicate digital back-ups are really only an
answer, but sadly not guaranteed for longevity. With hard-drives in
order to keep the bearings and discs spinning it is necessary to play
them on a regular basis. CJB

On 22/05/2018, Bryan Martin <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Faculty of Music concerts at UofT were archived on very expensive,
> archive-quality HHB discs from about 1999 to 2014. Around 2007 we
> discovered, quite by accident, that some of these were failing within 6
> months. That led to a massive push to rip the content from these discs. Some
> were recoverable only by doing a 1x speed transfer from a TASCAM CD-210 to
> an HHB CD-recorder. Out of nearly 1000 recordings, several dozen were
> completely unrecoverable, and a few hundred were recovered but with
> noticeable damage to the audio. A lot of the discs had very pronounced
> clicking, which we found could be removed satisfactorily using declicking
> software. The primary lesson learned is that a manufacturer's reputation is
> not particularly trustworthy. When I reached out to HHB, I got a terse reply
> from a sales rep, and nothing but crickets thereafter.
>
> We now archive digital recordings on a dedicated file server (for immediate
> access), a NAS box (as a backup), and to M-Disc DVDs, which have proved to
> be very robust so far.
>
> As far as TY CD-Rs go, wasn't the main selling point that they burned
> essentially error-free? That's great, but I think experience teaches us that
> dye-based media can't be counted on for durability, regardless of who makes
> them.
>
>
> Bryan Martin, MusBac, MA
> Technical Supervisor
> Music Library
> University of Toronto
> (416) 978-3739
> https://music.library.utoronto.ca
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List
> <[log in to unmask]> On Behalf Of Steven Smolian
> Sent: May 14, 2018 7:11 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] CD-R life
>
> Not specifically, but there was no evasive words used.
>
> Steve
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Eli Bildirici
> Sent: Monday, May 14, 2018 6:43 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] CD-R life
>
> Hahaha, I don't doubt. Do you remember what they said?
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> From: Steven Smolian <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Monday, May 14, 2018 06:13 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] CD-R life
>
>>Back in the day when I was on the AES committee creating the standards for
>> testing CDs,  I saw an outrageous claim by TY in a print ad.  I contacted
>> them and was told that they arrived at their figures by tweaking the
>> testing parameters to give their product the best results.   Exactly why
>> we need standards.
>>
>>Steve Smolian
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List
>>[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Eli Bildirici
>>Sent: Monday, May 14, 2018 4:29 PM
>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] CD-R life
>>
>>(IOW, in my initial post here, which I am now realizing you weren't
>>responding to, I should have specified that TY's dye composition/mfr
>>process lives on, somehow, under CMC. I realize now that the way I
>>phrased it in my reply to you sounded ambiguous. Carry on)
>>
>>-------- Original Message --------
>>From: Lou Judson <[log in to unmask]>
>>Sent: Monday, May 14, 2018 04:12 PM
>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] CD-R life
>>
>>>
>>> Eli, are you saying geniune Japanese TY CDRs are still available? If so,
>>> where, or is it secret?
>>>
>>> <L>
>>> Lou Judson
>>> Intuitive Audio
>>> 415-883-2689
>>>
>>> On May 14, 2018, at 12:42 PM, Eli Bildirici
>>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>
>>> > I am aware, but iirc error tests with e.g. CD-DVD Speed show the CMC
>>> > Mag disks are less robust than the Japanese manufactured ones, though
>>> > the formula is the same. This may have affected long-term longevity
>>> > somewhat too but it's only been a couple of years, so it's hard to know
>>> > for sure. In any case the theme in this thread seems to be 'dye
>>> > matters, and proper storage matters quite a lot as well'.
>>> > I should have mentioned that they are still available though and are
>>> > still probably your best bet.
>>> >
>>> > -------- Original Message --------
>>> > From: Lou Judson <[log in to unmask]>
>>> > Sent: Monday, May 14, 2018 03:33 PM
>>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>>> > Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] CD-R life
>>> >
>>> >>
>>> >> TY formula still available:
>>> >> <https://www.amazon.com/CMC-Pro-Powered-Technology-Watershield/dp/
>>> >> B000LUC8WW>
>>> >> <http://www.microboards.com/blank-media/cmc-pro-media/cmc-pro-cd-r
>>> >> -media>
>>> >> search for TY CDrs for more info.
>>> >> I won’t use anything else, until forced to.
>>> >> <L>
>>>
>