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Ted,

If I thought it very important to include someone’s gender in the authority record, I might do it based on a photo.  I don’t think it’s that important.

If you do it, probably you ought to cite the picture as your evidence.

Pete

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gemberling, Ted P
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 1:46 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Citing proof of gender in 670 for 375

Pete and Jesse, I’m guessing this is because you think the person might look masculine or feminine but might claim some other gender.

Could this be putting rules above practicality? Are you so worried about breaking a rule that you don’t want to give information that might help people?

I have only used a picture as evidence of gender once. It was a picture of a middle aged man, and the book was published, I think, in the 70’s or 80’s.

If we say someone looks like a man or woman and someone later says “no, that’s incorrect,” we can change it. Of course I wouldn’t use a picture as evidence if the gender looked ambiguous.

Ted

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> On Behalf Of Wilson, Pete
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 1:21 PM
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Citing proof of gender in 670 for 375

Dangerous!  I would never use a picture as my only evidence.

I think you could use a statement like “masculine pronouns used in information about author,” citing a page as a source.

Pete Wilson
Vanderbilt University

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Gemberling, Ted P
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 1:18 PM
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Citing proof of gender in 670 for 375

Sometimes there will also be a picture of the person that allows you to identify their gender. I mention the picture in the 670.

Ted Gemberling
UAB Lister Hill Library

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> On Behalf Of Jesse Lambertson
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 1:14 PM
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [PCCLIST] Citing proof of gender in 670 for 375

Jay

My personal opinion is that we need a declarative statement in the work that talks about or describes the person's gender

I don't think there are names one can say are 'truly' gendered to be honest

In your example using 'his" in the text, I would think that would be enough to justify a 375 males $2 lcdgt

my 2 pfennigs

thank you

On Mon, Aug 13, 2018 at 2:11 PM Shorten, Jay <[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
Is there a best practice citation format for proof of gender in the 670 for the data we put in the 375? Is there a best practice as to when to do it? Obviously we should do it in doubtful or unusual situations, but would it be odd to do this for everyone?

Example: our person’s name is Shelby R. Gilley. Our proof that this is a man’s name is on page 63 (Shelby Gilley wrote about his friendship). Would “page 63 (his)” be sufficient? Or even “page 63 ([male])”? I have found cases where the only proof is the name itself as a clearly masculine or feminine name, or the only proof is the author’s picture.

Jay Shorten
Cataloger, Monographs and Electronic Resources
Associate Professor of Bibliography
Description & Access Department
University Libraries
University of Oklahoma
Co-ordinator, Oklahoma (Tornado) NACO Funnel
Co-owner, PERSNAME-L, the list about personal names in bibliographic and authority records
[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>







--
Jesse A Lambertson
Head of Cataloging & Metadata
Georgetown University Law Library
[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Ph: 202-662-9167