I've been using the trial RX8 Wow and Flutter tool  on some old live
classical oratorio  tape recordings  and have had no joy so far.
There's no bias signal likely as they're very early paper tape
recordings from around 1950 with nothing over 5 kHz recorded.  
Beginning about half way through the tape, wow at about 2 Hz begins
and increases in intensity till the tape's end.    

50 Hz mains tone plus 100 Hz and 150 Hz harmonics are  recorded on
the tape and  visible on the RX8 spectrum display. They show the
beginning of the wow at about 2 HZ and eventually show the steady
change in average frequency, plus the increasingly strong wow. I know
such low Hz tones fall well short of the information available in bias
tones but I can see them right there on the display. Even the 50 Hz
tone is audibly and visibly modulated at 2 Hz.  I'd love to be able 
to use these tones as a time base reference. Does anyone have success
using mains tones and harmonics and know of software which can use
such lower Hz tones?

Thanks Tim.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List"
<[log in to unmask]>
To:<[log in to unmask]>
Sent:Mon, 14 Sep 2020 12:32:21 -0400
Subject:Re: [ARSCLIST] Izotope RX8; recordings of FM broadcasts with
multipath distortion

 Hi, Karl,

 You are correct that it works based on using the music itself as a 
 reference. It has complex algorithms that attempt to minimize the 
 reduction of vibrato as it stands. I'd love to have a relatively
 segment or three of music to try it on.

 The challenge for me is much of the worst wow and flutter I come
 is on spoken word recordings and neither RX8 or Capstan can function 
 well with those as I understand it. Neither of those programs do what

 Plangent can do.



 On 2020-09-14 12:05 p.m., Karl Miller wrote:
 > Related to RX 8...are there any opinions of the new feature to deal
with pitch fluctuations and how it might be relative to capstan? I am
concerned about music passages with vibrato.
 > Karl
 > On Sunday, September 13, 2020, 08:12:13 PM CDT, Tim Gillett
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:
 > Hi Charles, Have you tried the suggestions around summing to mono?
 > can work quite well, with few or no artifacts.
 > Tim.
 > ----- Original Message -----
 > From: "Association for Recorded Sound Discussion List"
 > <[log in to unmask]>
 > To:<[log in to unmask]>
 > Cc:
 > Sent:Sun, 13 Sep 2020 17:25:30 -0700
 > Subject:Re: [ARSCLIST] Izotope RX8; recordings of FM broadcasts
 > multipath distortion
 > Richard and Lou,
 > Thank you very much for the ideas.  You've given me back some hope
 > for
 > these tapes. I was using RX7 spectral de-noise, but it was leaving
 > too
 > much residual noise, and I couldn't push it further without losing
 > content and creating artifacts.  It seems I need to be a bit more
 > adventuresome in my experimentation.
 > I have RX7 advanced, so the upgrade cost to 8 advanced is not too
 > terrible
 > Will let you know if I am successful using what you have suggested.
 > chuck
 > find some non-destructive ways of
 > On 9/13/2020 1:48 PM, Richard L. Hess wrote:
 > > Hi, Lou,
 > >
 > > That is a good suggestion, but we already have an M-S thing going
 > on
 > > as I explained in a previous email. All the noise is in the L-R
 > > channel which, unfortunately was mixed back into the quiet L+R
 > channel
 > > when the stereo was demodulated in the tuner to make the tape
 > > recording. So, the act of summing L + R from the tape will act to
 > > cancel out the noise, but the balance between L + R will need to
 > > tuned for minimum noise, as you know when you're trying to null
 > > things, 1-2 dB in level makes a big difference.
 > >
 > > I haven't thought what subsequent M-S processing might do, but
 > > would put it back into L+R and L-R and might be another way of
 > looking
 > > at the same thing...just attenuating the S channel would work the
 > same
 > > as summing, but the match is critical in either case.
 > >
 > > Cheers,
 > >
 > > Richard
 > >
 > >
 > >
 > > On 2020-09-13 4:35 p.m., Lou Judson wrote:
 > >> I wonder if an MS treament would help with multipath - EQ the
 > >> signal to reduce noise, bost the mid to compensate, then
 > recombine. I
 > >> don;t have a sample to try this on but it has worked for me for
 > >> stereo noise in the past.
 > >>
 > >> <L>
 > >> Lou Judson
 > >> Intuitive Audio
 > >> 415-883-2689
 > >>
 > >>> On Sep 13, 2020, at 1:16 PM, Lou Judson <[log in to unmask]>
 > wrote:
 > >>>
 > >>> FM multipath? Good question. Have you tried it in mono?
 > the
 > >>> receiver cleans it right up, but I don’t now about after it
 > >>> recorded.
 > >
 > --
 > Charles Reinsch
 > KRAB Archive:
 > -------------------------
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 Richard L. Hess email: [log in to unmask]
 Aurora, Ontario, Canada 647 479 2800
 Track Format - Speed - Equalization - Azimuth - Noise Reduction
 Quality tape transfers -- even from hard-to-play tapes.

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